The Future Frontiers of NFT Innovation - TOKEN2049 Dubai 2024

yo yo this is Luca from pudy penguin stand up for a sec stand up watch how intimidating this is and he has a penguin pfb imagine the shock backstage look I'm intimidating in my height but I got to keep you away from my girlfriend I didn't know so good looking in person look guys one I told the panel behind behind the scenes backstage I said I'm going to ask the tough questions the questions that and I'll avoid the boring questions that everyone asks and I'm going to start with Luca himself um you know we've been on stage together yeah you were a lot nicer on Spaces than you were in person but I asked you something behind the scenes and and we kind of went back and forth is very directly man nfts is it over of course not I'm talking about NFD pfbs never I think if you study 2017 coins and 2021 to 2024 nfts the similarities between 2017 coins and 2020 coins and 2021 nfts and 2024 nfts are almost identical in 2017 you had a series of you know 20 coins that everyone thought were the future of crypto they washed out six or seven remained same thing happened with nfts you had 20 that you thought were the Pinnacle of nfts six or seven remained in 2020 the unlock of Leverage came into play and basically ran defi summer and we basically had a had a monster leveraged runup and fomo driven runup in 2020 that ultimately led to the next bull market what's happened in 2023 and 2024 is the unlock of Leverage of nfts and so the second they start you know gaining some momentum again I think they're going to run greater than they've ever ran before uh and I'm really excited to kind of see what that looks like but if you understand traditional Finance or just Finance in general the world runs on Leverage nfts have never seen leverage before uh and I think the moves are going to be really violent and I think you're going to see pfps bigger than they've ever been once they catch the narrative again all right so I want to get more convinced and and we've got the heavy weights of the nft ecosystem or at least the pfp nft is on stage with us uh Tiffany one thing I was shocked by and I told you that backstage magic Eden somehow is number one and if my numbers are correct in terms of volume five times bigger than openc is that right this is mental um first how but second kind of linking to what Luca is saying can you give us some numbers on why pfp nfts are not dead yeah um I can think of 700 million uh reasons AKA our volume in the last 30 days as to why nmts are not volume 700 million in volume over the last 30 days but it's not actually just about the numbers I guess like can I actually get a raise of hands who who here is familiar with magic Eden has used magic Eden before oh man that's like so gratifying to see because I I remember like the first time I went to East Denver in like 2022 I had to repeatedly tell people about magic Eden and like nobody had heard of magic Eden so um I'll be quick and then yeah we can talk more about magic Ean strategy in a bit but we are the number one nft Marketplace today um kind of what makes us different is the fact that one we are multi-chain meaning we are on four blockchains today we're proudly the number one marketplaces on both ordinals as well as salana and we are on ethereum and polygon as well on top of that we also have an ecosystem that we are building so we have a wallet product called Magic Eden wallet and through this kind of experience of having a multi-chain Marketplace as well as like a endtoend service from a product point of view we offer both the breadth of community as well as like the depth of the product and so I mean there's like a lot of War Stories as to like how we got here um but it was through a lot of like taking a lot of Bets with imperfect information that we like took the leap to orinal that we built a wallet and like you know we're we're proud to live another day um Tiffany just before going to Michael um you talked about the various chains that you have on on Magic Eden I think backstage you told me that there's another chain can I mention it yeah yeah absolutely so around the end of this month um we're also going to be adding base so excited so my question though is um can you tell us more about nfts on those again focusing on pfp did you just yawn man no I saw you y i i saw you ya I just said Bas nft someone tweet this out Luca from Budgy Penguins yawned at Magic Eden just saying what never magic I yawned at Bas nfts nice one bro um but can you tell us more about nfds on the various chains tring give us some numbers as well uh you've got ordinals gaining a lot of traction I've been talking about the Bitcoin ecosystem for the last couple of days salana everyone knows what salana achieved in the last few months eth is it still King and then bass is it gaining traction yeah I can talk a little bit and then I think think you have like some thoughts about bass I'll let you take the lead on there but um yeah obviously ordinals are on a huge tear right now and I would think about like what did the different nfts across the different chains represent so ordinals to me is like a lot was cut out like when there were there were nfts that were on like ethereum and salana there was a big period when people were like oh we got to like have utility you know what's what why should I hold this nft what kind of other value can I drive towards me and then ordinal is like takes that thesis and punches it in the face and it's like nfts should just be simple and they should be a provenance play and so to us like Bitcoin is the most obvious way that nfts are truly just like they're just art on the blockchain and turns out people really like that and people are really bullish on bitcoin I'd say like on salana what you've seen is like salana has a very developer Centric culture and so as a result of that a lot of the top nfts on salana are actually like parts of like businesses whether it's like P Finance like mad Lads um you know a lot of these collections you can actually Trace back to businesses and then I think like you know on ethereum obviously ethereum is like the first chain that ever had nfts so there's already a lot of like native kind of nft culture that lives on that chain and I think different chains will represent like different value propositions and different types of cultures for nfts I don't know yeah so so I'm going to link it to the same question there Michael by the way I'm taking notes for questions I'm not texting anyone and my questions are very selfish here CU we're you know we invest very heavily in projects and have for years we haven't been that active in the nft ecosystem and I want to find out if we're making a mistake or not so my questions are kind of based on that any investors would appreciate this um so um Tiffany you talked about ordinals being a Providence play salana being more of a utility play e more kind of being utility Providence or a mix of both I don't know I I think it's also too soon to say like one chain is one exact thing cuz there's also like art on salana but I think Bitcoin ordinals people do recognize that that's like the prominance play salana ethereum and other nfts I think they're still kind of feeling it out and it it really comes from like who is building on that chain right now and on salana you're seeing like a lot of you know great businesses like defi is starting to Boom back on salana again after an amazing run for soul in the last year um eth I think we're kind of we're going to see I I don't know maybe you have an you guys have some ANS talk about eth and more importantly bass wasn't even mentioned uh but it's been gaining more and more you know being part of the narrative in recent weeks yeah I think when you look at B you got to get your mic a tiny bit up I can't hear you too well um yeah can you hear me perfect much better yeah cool yeah when you look at Bass um actually it's it's a version of optimism which is a different layer too and it's connected to coinbase so there's really natural way to onramp a lot of people into a layer two and um the latest updates on ethereum allow for something called blobs and it actually makes it so that doing a transaction on base is like less than a penny so it's actually cheaper than doing it on salana so I think there's like technical advantages to building something on base but one of the interesting things also if you're a Creator is the incentives that you can get just for experimenting like there's a lot of people who want to build something publish an nft and just like dabble in it especially artists and there's a lot of incentives that people might not know about so optimism actually gave out 10 million optimism which is you know around 30 to $40 million to 23,000 different wallets and all you had to do was mint a base nft like create a Bas nft and that averages out to about $2,000 so like think if you're an artist and you want to get into the crypto space but you don't really know and you know you're not you're maybe going to sell one or two things you can dabble and there's a protocol level incentive for you to get like $2,000 on top of just trying to like B is getting more more creative yeah with their use cases yeah okay and then how how where is eth right now you know I'm kind of more of a punk guy we don't have give a bag of nfts I think it's really funny to hear all of this like where is eth stuff because it's like 95% of all tvl is on eth it like can't be ignored I think right now a lot of attention is going to ordinals for sure but like in the cyclical nature of everything I think that we're going to see a really big swing back to eth nft how how are the numbers um Michael and just just for the audience like just make sure you look at the panel I don't know if you can see it here all you can't see the names oh there they are you got some of the biggest names in the ecosystem kind of giving you Alpha and um Michael yeah talking about eth can you give me some numbers volume on eth versus and maybe Tiffany can help on that do you guys know the numbers on eth versus salana versus right now the Bitcoin like we're right around happening like it's we're we're good like a really big moment in Bitcoin history like we're we're in a really big moment for Bitcoin history and um so a lot of energy is around that it's around the um ver can you hear me yeah cuz someone fix his mic so it keeps falling down we can't hear it fall off you know you know we're talking about Yuga here guys we got to make sure we we know what what yuga's saying um and and maybe okay your mic is working go ahead finish off yeah so I think it's opportunity cost about where the narrative is right now like the way that you see Bitcoin and the happing and the runes meta coming out like all of that stuff means people want to do activity over there but we're going to see how that shakes out I think there's going to be a lot of people who make a lot of money on runes on the Bitcoin happening in general but then usually when that happens there's a rotation yeah and last question for you before going back to Luca and I'll just ask a question that no one asked but everyone wants to know the answer to that's a question for you Michael not for youa yeah um for people wanting to invest in the ecosystem not investment advice where should they invest I think you should collect what you love I mean you should really get it because you believe in the underlying ecosystem behind it so Michael don't ever say collect what you love for people that don't love nfds but they love money what do you think are the ecosystems that are undervalued right now not investment advice I mean I think you've seen an outpouring into uh board apat Club this week one of the things that we did was we we actually have a lot of different IPS at Yuga right now and just a couple of days ago we spun out two of them to another gaming company because I think it's really important to know what you're good at and what you're not good at and we were able to spin it out in a way that uh makes everybody in that ecosystem a winner and like rewards holders from day one and as a result a lot of people saw Yuga bringing Focus back to what got BC to BC and what got Yuga to Yuga and so you're seeing a lot more confidence come into our ecosystem and I think you're going to see a lot more energy come back into eth nfts in general I'm going to ask you that question again and I'm going to ask it to Luca and Tiffany you're not allowed to talk about pudy penguins or um Yuga when I ask that question later on um one last quick question we'll go back to Luca um is very very brief question is um punks just can you promise me there's not going to be utility for punks anytime soon no we're very careful with punks thank you please please remain careful um Luca first I want give you credit like in the midst of the bare Market when everyone was on nfds and and on I think it's on the crypto Town Hall you were I think the the first person from the nftd ecosystem that we brought up on stage I do remember Scott yeah we had that back and forth uh so Scott mker is in the audience for anyone watching the recording and Scott would kill me whenever I bring anyone with a pfb on stage like genuinely would' be arguing behind the scenes but you CH you were one of the people that kind of triggered his his his Chang in sentiment um and uh his logic kicking in um what's the strategy with paji penguins you guys have done really well in the utility you created you kind of led the way I remember in the early days when we're kind of going through the whole Walmart announcement um has your strategy shifted in this wol market and how that relates to the audience for anyone looking at the nftd ecosystem when it's not getting enough love or as much love as it deserves you kind of get an idea of what to look for like how how are the developers the the people leading that the the the industry how are they looking at kind of evolving and with the market yeah I I think you you have to play Within the arena in which you're kind of thrown into and so in the bare Market there's a bare Market Arena and there's a bare Market strategy in Playbook that I think is like very predicated on like giving and you know spearheading a revolution in this case like I think we did a great job leading the charge on what it meant to actually create a brand in the space and you know bring people you know get people excited about nfts create Mass adoption and so I think we we were we were really good at that in the bear I think in the bull market what I've realized is you have to be bold and and I think it's time for us to take some some big swings at bat and try to hit some home runs examples um well you'll you'll find out you'll find out in May something small now no you'll find out in May but I think I think you're going to see us really start take some taking some big swings to the fences uh at some point in May and regardless though I think the principle of nfts Remains the Same these identities are Vin Goods I I was talking to somebody who's more traditional they're like why does the nfts make sense uh and I kind of explained to them like this A A friend of mine or a colleague of mine his name is Logan Paul he he bought a a a3.5 million doll Pokemon card and he put it on a chain and I was like why would he do that and then I thought about it I was like well you know if I spend $3.5 million on something I want to wear it I want to be able to like almost Flex it and show people that this is what I'm wearing and I thought about it I was like well in a in a digital world in a world where we spend more and more time on our phone and more and more time interacting on social this idea that I have this Vin good as a pfp is actually something that I think is not to be underestimated you know what people really optimize for especially on the Internet is status right I want people to know that I'm a part of this group group I want to be a part of this community and so for us community and culture is at the foundation of everything like we we've spent many many years at pudgy Penguins you know making sure that all the right people have this identity and are a part of this group so that when you wear a pudy penguin pfp you know you are aligning yourself with some of the biggest VCS the best Builders some of the most affluent you know people within the space so that there's this type of camarad and this type of status uh you know on The Social Network that made sense in the last bll Market I'll just be direct someone having a punk nft does it still have the same status it did before of course I mean Maybe not maybe not today what's the floor not today right but but it's not but it's not necessarily predicated on floor it's it's it's it's predicated on being a thought leader and being ahead of the curve I think L I think it does today still like being a crypt Punk owner is a status symbol and will always be yes abut oh 123k that's FL but I but I think it's it's more than that right it's like I know I know projects that I think yield status that are not you know $10,000 on the floor and so I think it's not not status more identity status semantics I get what you mean so you still have CU I remember that was in the last bull market where people gave a about a community and every nft represented something um I'm not as deep as you guys to be able to tell you what each leading NFC represents but maybe I'll let you L at us what does crypt punks I won't say you because you're here and what does fudi penguins maybe another two what do they represent the reason I asked this is kind of understand how how are nfts in the community they create how what type of identities do they have now if someone has a pfp of a crypto BK what what would be the first word that comes to mind Vin good say again V blin good okay right like when I when when I when I think that I I think or this person is probably more ahead of the curve in technology than most I think pudgy Penguins is crypto culture I think Bard Apes is pop culture I think uh mad Lads is salana cultureuk Anime culture okay so that the identity aspect still stand stood the test of time and I and I think it's it's it's almost like where do meme coins fall short if they fall short on proliferation the beauty about nfts is they're almost like self-fulfilling prophecies if you have the right people wearing them okay yeah yeah the the network effect yeah okay um I had one more good question for you um oh yeah interoperability with games so something I I feel like an idiot because I've been talking about it for so long but it hasn't you go you'd be great at talking about this in a bit Michael but um is that something you you've looked into for pudgy penguins and if you have already and it's already public knowledge forgive me yeah I think it's my job to make sure that we can proliferate in as many places as possible so making things inoperable is obviously key but I I really think that nft is at its core it's really just a supply and demand model the beauty of nfts and why they're so exciting at least from like a monetary gain perspective is the fact that in pudgy penguin's case is there's 8,888 in board Apes case there's only 10,000 from a unit basis from a token perspective it's incredibly small and and at any given time there's what how many 3 400 500 listed there's probably you know with any given collection thousands that you know will never list or never hit the market and I'm just a a huge supply and demand Maxi and I think this is where nfts get really exciting is if you keep the the supply finite and and you you honor the the the small token Supply and don't segment liquidity and concentrate liquidity all you have to do is create more demand so if I you know am spearheading a partnership by making our pfp and operable and in this game with 20,000 users or 100,000 users what that's doing it's creating more demand and more awareness around the penguin or if I'm you know making social content or putting toys in Walmart and all the other retailers ultimately what that's doing is it's creating more awareness around the penguin which ultimately over time trickles down to demand across the nft and that's not you know hey do I think a kid who's buying a pudgy penguin toy at Walmart's going to buy a toy do I think that no but I think you know uh a crypto VC who's you know buying a pudgy toy for their kid who now has an nft fund you know is then thinking to themselves like well you know this penguin's now sitting in my face maybe we should allocate funds here it's it's a matter of proliferation how you can Market while also keeping the supply look at man read the headline here pudgy Penguins taking World by storm I was looking at news see what's the latest with pudgy penguins and I think a lot of focus is on the Collectibles um stores Across America with plans on television shows and movies is that public knowledge just briefly cuz I want to go to Tiffany you just love to get something out of me huh yeah look I get straight to it I know the audience is here not to listen to the same over and over again yeah know we got some big news ah cool he's confirmed that pudy penguin has a TV show and a movie coming in soon the you I didn't say that I said it fig said that Tiffany I want to go back to actually I've got a good question for you here and something that um first anything that Luca said that you disagree with disagree no I mean I think it's great I think it's oh it's like our honor to host these projects that are going to bat and trying to like create a completely new paradigm of Ip of gaming of everything and yeah it's our job just to provide the rails for you guys to like do your thing my job is to squeeze so much Alpha from you guys so you hate me and they like and it was working got all Al everyone's coming all right so so we know yet you're going to theod Disney everybody um def the question of you is that it's actually a broad question um it's again a selfish question we're far from what we were in 2021 what do you think is need I'm talking from from a you know kind of liquidity perspective um and volume perspective what is needed to trigger that I'm going to use the word hype that we had in previous Cycles what are nfts missing just let me interject really quick you need to start talking about nfts on the show again again Mario say it again on my show you stopped you went from all about n we'll do it you got to set Trends you can't give yeah but give me reasons you guys are setting the nft trend I'm the one that reports on it so what El Su what is missing from the nft ecosystem other than money okay K I don't want to actually talk about hype and Trends I want to talk about like building like consumer crypto you guys are tough that no cuz like this phrase consumer crypto gets tossed around a lot and in order for Consumer crypto to actually be a thing and for like these guys to have like a thriving ecosystem you have to build a platform that kind of puts them in front right like on a lot of these apps like daps today they are they fall like kind of within a chain and in that world you have very siloed ecosystems but what magic Eden is trying to do and what we have done is like we are the only consumer crypto app when it comes to nft marketplaces because we're able to cut through different chains and offer creators a platform where they can really be as Limitless as they want to be how so can you can you give me examples um why does that really matter it matters because creators are we are all on this stage like trying to figure out um how to be successful in an industry that is pre product Market fit on like Tech that is pre-product Market fit so what they looking for product Market fit for the for for the ecosystem like for nfts to truly penetrate into crypto retail and even beyond that like the tech cannot be a a hurdle like it cannot be a burden it cannot be like a shortcoming so the creators can actually do things across multiple chains they can have multiple Services across different chains which is why like when we launched right we we had we were from the very beginning we had like a launch pad product we had a secondary Marketplace product now we have a wallet product we have a swaps product we're launching runes soon and we're going to be on like five you know five different chains including Bas so so uh I'm going to give you a massive shout out again that we gave uh early on is um magic Eden's number one I was shocked before coming on stage five times bigger than Open Sea love you open se but uh numbers speak for themselves um so that's a shout out to Magic Eden going back to the NFD ecosystem as a whole I want to kind of trigger you know obviously the numbers speak for themselves like more and more people coming in as we talk about um an asset class in crypto that hasn't has kind of lagged behind everything else so my question to you is that the same question I asked earlier so what is missing beyond the technological limitations and then for people wanting to enter the ecosystem what should they look for like Luke has given a few examples yeah but but I I don't think it's I don't think it's lacking anything I mean you think if you think on principle what we've done what yuga's done what so many projects have now come and done compared to what they've done in 2021 you just have to understand the cycle that nfts play in Bull markets nfts are the place where people put their magic internet money when they on the later half right like it's cular when you look at the opportunity costs at least in the beginnings of the cycle everybody picks coins because of the liquidity from the first time around but I think nfts are going to catch a serious bid halfway into this to the later half and I think that's just how the cycle works it's like does Bitcoin stop working is Bitcoin missing something you know when it goes from 69,000 to 16,000 no not necessarily right and I actually think in our case there's been huge developments you just have to understand that at the end of the day nfts are you know they're status symbols they're velin Goods like I will repeat that until the end of time and and in a in a crypto native world like that becomes the you yield that status when you've made a ton of money on coins and then you rotate it and then becomes the narrative wait I I just want to say one thing like there was a period last year on salana when everyone was like salana nfts are dead I'm sure like a lot of people remember this right and like does anybody actually remember what was the Catalyst for salana nft starting to fly again happened around like the end of last year okay it was SPL 20s which was basically people taking technology from Bitcoin and trying to put it on Tech on salana it was like a technological innovation and it was a new asset class and that ultimately led to like a huge Salon of run and that lifted like it was like a tie that like lifts all boats so I I really like I feel like there are often these really Sensational narratives like nfts are going to die but I think nfts are doing just fine and there will always be like a new meta and why is that is because nfts are like an the only asset class that's like emotional to the user like people feel so deeply connected to this thing that's a completely different Paradigm from like meme coins that they will always always want to represent it they will always want to like wear it they will always want to incorporate it into their life and that is something that you like cannot find in any other asset class on crypto yeah um Michael I'm going to ask you another question like you guys at Yuga rais a ton of money and kind of leading the charge and innovation in the ecosystem you've experimented a lot and my question to you is what worked and what didn't work and it's a tough question and the yeah the reason I'm asking this kind of related to the audience is you know you've got these guys spending a a hell of a a lot of money to kind of test things and then we just got to listen to them and see what works and at least for my end this is where I'll be investing well one of the things that I talked about earlier is we identified some stuff that we weren't good at and we actually found a better home for it and it's in a way that is going to grow our networks and allow us to focus on what moves the needle but when we talk about like nft Innovation and yeah we do spend a lot of energy time and money trying to figure out the next thing I think it boils down to the question of like what does web 3 do better than web 2 and for us like what I say internally at Yuga time and time again is that web 3 is really good at solving the cold start problem and I don't think enough people talk about that the cold start problem it's sort of like if you were coming out with an instant messaging app I would join it if my friends were on it and I could talk to them but my my friends are only going to join if I'm on it right so you're in this chicken and egg thing how do you solve the cold start problem and crypto Primitives are really good at solving this like you see it in defi for instance you could put your money in the bank and get a yield at the bank or you could put your money in a dii protocol and it as soon as there's some amount of time when they cut you into the protocol you could actually get a better return than putting it in the bank right you could have more say and so that's really like a way to bootstrap liquidity but I think the secret here is and you know this is one of the things that could spark the next wave of innovation is when people realize that it's not just restricted to liquidity you could use crypto Primitives to bootstrap almost anything like you could use crypto Primitives to bootstrap Community to bootstrap charity to bootstrap entire Brands like when you look at Instagram and if you were building it on web 3 you would really able to check out what are people's contributions to the growth of the protocol and you could reward them a slice of the protocol right now on Instagram they Chang the algorithm you're dead like you have no say in that but in a web 3 version you would actually opt into the governance of that and have control over your future so I think when you're really looking at where Innovation can start I think it's actually a very at the very beginning which is like you can overcome the cold start problem and solve this this like chicken and egg problem of like two more questions Michael um ingame assets like I've been talking about it for so long we've invested so heavily in it and then the team's giving me that's underperformed since the last ball market and throughout the bay Market why for me this is the most logical use case for nfts like it just makes so much sense it doesn't mean just want to point out one thing it's not every in-game asset is going to be valuable um it's like similar to not every asset like toilet paper is not worth as much as as much as Lucas watch um so the same thing in game assets certain assets don't need to increase in value others are designed to increase in value so can you tell me more about why though yeah I think it's a dist it's actually a distribution problem cu the scale that we're talking out when we're talking about Vin Goods like that's only because we have very limited runs of low thousands but most games in the world that are very successful have monthly active users in the like tens of millions right so they could bring the price of these objects down dramatically and one of the things that we're working on we had a successful game last year called Doogie Dash It's like a it's an infinite Runner and it's a casual game but how's it doing now so what we're doing is we're actually releasing it on mobile and at nft Paris we did a closed beta and just in nft Paris it had 100,000 downloads so we're working out the top of the funnel to make sure it's very clean as people come into it but if you could take that you could see a really clear path how Yuga could get into millions of wallets but that's not really the like inapp purchases that's very web too the really cool thing about it is the creator economy built on top of it in traditional games the game company builds a skin they'll build the entire game just so they they could sell you skins right and what we're doing is you're going to be able to put your skins on the marketplace and if people buy it you get a cut of that skin but the most important thing to make that feasible is distribution without distribution you're never going to get the scale where people are willing to pay 99 Cents for a skin and you're going to get 50% of it or whatever percentage so so bullish would you say in general for this bull market bullet very briefly because I want to go to the last question the best one is the alpha question but um the and you're not allowed to talk about Yuga no Penguins um the the in-game assets are you bullish it's already an alpha question are you bullish on in-game assets for this ball Market oh yeah too early absolutely me too all right and and last Quick very very quickly IP I wanted to talk more about it the IP plays you guys have but we have to keep it brief we don't have too long um how's that strategy going is it working out well what have you learned oh it's great you know one of the things that board apes are based off of is giving out the IP to let people build their own things their own businesses their own events products oh yeah it's great we have over 400 people officially registered out of you know the 10,000 and we have a waiting list that's in the high hundreds right now so it's it's a really interesting thing to see how that could grow the network and grow the protocol and grow visibility even more it's very common for people to go around New York and to be able to see a shop that's branded with a board ape it's it's very common all right so so last question I think this is a question that not enough panels ask but everyone wants to know including myself is we got the leaders of the industry on stage all together um Luke I'm going to start with you I'll be straight to the point any Alpha like what are things you're I'll ask the question in a more eloquent way what are things you're interested in uh for the next year or two for the for nfts in general especially pfbs Penguins not included yeah I'm I'm I'm just excited to kind of see what this new layer of infrastructure is going to bring in terms of uh liquidity towards nfts I think nfts have been you know intrinsically a liquid and I think now with the unlocks of Leverage perss call options shorts the whole nine I think it just adds so much exciting you know metrics to the to the potential price action and and I just want to elaborate on one thing figgy said because I think it's really fascinating don't underestimate the tokenization of assets or adding tokens to your business model and what that creates uh people people say this all the time but or people don't really know this about me but before pudgy Penguins I had a company called gel Blaster was the North America's fastest growing toy company we we grew it to Zer to1 million in sales in 18 months and that business was incredibly incredibly difficult to to build but with pudy penguins we actually had built a a bigger business from an Impressions and througho and unit metric sell through in a shorter amount of time in 12 12 months and it was because of this align incentive that I think tokens add uh to business models and so whether you're building a charity or a consumer product brand or an IP or you're seeing this with tokens and meme coins the P the aligned incentives that tokenization or that tokens add uh to communities make communities so much more powerful uh and is a and is a leverage and a lever that is not to be underestimated so uh super excited to see what infrastructure brings uh and obviously what people like magic Eden are doing to the space and I think nfts are going to go into their 2020 defi summer era here pretty soon all right Tiffany I guess my major thing that I want to share is like today magic Eden is the number one nft Marketplace we have 60% 70% of all the volume as well as all of the wallets that transact on nfts a lot of people don't know this I'm telling you now I think in the future though what we are what we have our sites on is not just being the number One nft Marketplace but building like a true ecosystem so magic Eden wallet which I mentioned before has like 450,000 monthly active users it's actually almost like the number one wallet that's used on Magic Eden today and in that wallet we have swaps and then on our Marketplace we're going to have runes so there is like there are foray into US playing like in the fibl world as well so if you think about Magik and today it's the number one nft Marketplace in the future it's going to be an entire ecosystem and end to-end user your experience to help people on board into web 3 help them onboard into nfts so uh encourage you guys to to check that out I think in the near future what you guys can look forward to is we're launching base at the end of April we're launching runes very soon like next week um we are also going to be launching a mobile version of our app as well as embedding the the wallet into like the desktop experience so it'll just feel like coinbase you won't even have to have like the plugin anymore and in that World um we will be setting the stage for um another very large investment so one thing i' I've learned is like just watch the companies that have the most money and see what they're doing and you guys have been very Innovative I remember since the last ball market and just watching what you guys do very carefully like obviously introducing runes and and bass um among other things is um you know I we didn't talk enough about bass I was just really curious to learn more about it Michael I'm going to go to you cuz I know we don't have much time um is um first a question without talking about UGA what is interesting to you any Alpha you can share with the with the audience and second maybe a final comment on base nfts sure I think um when we look at what's interesting in the space it's going to be hard to ignore Bitcoin happening which is happening like imminently and all the stuff that comes out of that um I think when we reflect on this past week what Yugo was able to do is observe what we were good at look at what we weren't as good at and how we Judo that into a thing that's going to be a win for all of the ecosystem and every time we're able to make smart decisions like that you're seeing us gain more and more razor Focus so like that's something that I'm personally excited about when it comes to Bas I do think that we're going to see a lot more adoption and a lot more of a competitive story to the standard story between chains right now and I always I think we're always talking about chains and one day you know most of that will hopefully be abstracted down so that like your grandma use web 3 but right now if we're looking at just the technical Hardware I think the latest update on Bas and making it so that the transactions are as cheap as transacting on salana it really gives uh you know the ecosystem a good run for its money because now you're you're at you're back here what's that your M cut out for a bit for a second yeah you're really having to look at what improvements to these protocols actually mean to their position because I think there was like false narrative that to get low transactions you had to do it off ethereum but now it's actually the cheapest place to do transactions you guys avoid it cuz we don't have much time you avoided the toughest question I warned you behind the scenes what is the most overrated chain but we won't go there because we have only a few seconds left look on our end I think we we're kind of guilty um from from our investment side we haven't been that active in the nft ecosystem you know my team is right here and and and I'll probably chat to them afterwards um and for the audience I think sometimes you got to be early you got to try to look for what's not dominating The Narrative to try to to to be ahead of the curve and I think this panel focused on what most people in crypto are not really paying attention to um at least I've learned something so we have the heavy weights on stage I think it was a great discussion tough questions I appreciate you all doing this and uh hope you all enjoyed it thank you so much