Abhishek: Fintech for a Sustainable Future |14th Oct 2023 | Sunway University | ETHKL 2023

please give a big round of applause for the last speaker of the day thank you thank you Joe thank you everyone last session today right so uh definitely not a technical one no codes nothing uh for the next uh what 25 minutes not even 30 minutes yeah my talk is pretty timed um so for the next 25 minutes we're going to delving deep into this topic uh fintech for a sustainable future um social impact Investments using defi nfts AI a combination of all of those and so how exactly uh we're doing that I'm going to share with you with the help of two stories right plain and simple two stories these two so again as I mentioned completely non-technical talk and the objective the agenda is to help all of us understand that where has where have the use cases grown into you know what kind of use cases have started to come out and uh what we can do with Technologies such as not only just blockchain but diving deep into defi right borderless Finance helping segments sectors populations such as Farmers small holder Farmers not those yield Farmers actual real world Farmers you know growing crops harvesting crops how we can help them using such Technologies which they are not even aware of not a single farmer in my story the two faces that you see here uh yeah those are definitely fix but thousands of real such real Farmers right so none of them have an idea what def is what even blockchain is what nfts are right not even nothing about that so that's exactly so I'm going to take the help of two different stories I've worked across these three areas you can see the maps the one number one is Europe so I'm going to talk about an initiative in Europe which where we are again using blockchain defi nft all of that and the another story second part of my talk is going to be a story of financial inclusion across Africa as you can see there that's Africa and India same same story across both the both the country and the continent so yeah so these are these are uh the stories that I'm going to take the help of as I already mentioned uh this is how it has uh you know the areas that it works in but the challenge that we are solving uh with blockchain across these population segments is can also be done across other you know other countries other continents also because these kinds of challenges are exactly uh same across all those areas right if I'm talking about a farmer specific problem agre specific problem in India which I'm going to solve with the help of blockchain technology I can solve the same problem with blockchain in in you know in any part of Europe in Australia in you know in Colombia anywhere because the Agri Market all of that works pretty much similar so the first story the first concept the first story is uh about asset management for positive impact investment so what are the problems firstly uh when we are talking about positive impact Investments it is actually if you a donor it could be a retail donor such as you me or it could be an Institutional donor who are looking who have a corporate social responsibility fund Associated uh for donating to certain causes right ear marked they have these funds ear marked for such donations not for not for business uh uh you know or anything else globally 2.2 trillion such funds are available such donations are done worldwide out of that just in Europe and that's the reason why you could see that the first story revolves around Europe we chose Europe as a market is because $87 billion of those of that is completely online donations the problem is that the experience is very bad and not just the experience I'm not just talking about user experience or user interface the experience of transparency credibility all of that is very shady and now you can understand because of of all of those characteristics is where blockchain technology comes in is where decentralized Finance comes in is where people who are doing such donations wanted a solution which is much better which is much more transparent much more robust much more credible all of those characteristics bundled into one so that's why and that's why the Target because 87 billion online donations specifically when they're online is is what a platform can do but what are the problems right so these are the problems to funding an initiative this is why when we go back a step go a step back we can understand that why even apply blockchain technology to this number one is uh changing donor priorities right lack of awareness lack of transparency and credibility as I just mentioned right all of that creates ples this entire ecosystem where the donors are left um you know confused about the kind of impact they're able to make now this is where a platform with blockchain technology with a ledger right with a distributed Ledger comes in because at the end end of the say quarter they are they able to see exactly the kind of impact they were able to create over this quarter and how is the measurement done the measurement is done because right from The Giver to the receiver the donor to the receiver and any subsequent activities on the any sub subsequent activities by the receivers are all recorded on the blockchain which means that each piece of data every item is on the blockchain is on The Ledger and we can have a such an easy access to it at the end of the quarter we'll tell you how AI comes into it later so so uh overall institutional we saw just retail you me others retail households have more than 963 billion year mark for this so you can imagine that the numbers are so big and these are not people looking to you know spend these on lifestyle or anything else these are earmarked in your mindset if you're a retail investor you have this mindset that yes I'm going to donate to covid I'm going to donate to healthcare I'm going to donate to social impact I'm going to donate to Farmers you know children poverty biodiversity whatever it is is you have already earmarked this kind of a fund in your mind that you'll be donating to something but then at the end of the day what happens is these people have no motivation or knowledge of how to do it I'll tell you I I I didn't used to donate right I didn't used to earn before you know maybe quite a few years back so I didn't never donate it but during covid I was so touched and I wanted to donate and it was so complex I did see that during covid there were so many organizations who were able to accept crypto payments as well vitalic did some donations complet in crypto right and there were other people also were able to do that that kind of opened the eyes that okay even people have now started donating in crypto and on top of that receivers have started organiz organizations entities have started accepting crypto s donations now that's a huge thing especially in a country like India where the crypto laws were not were very gray a huge tax has been implemented right now kind of making it legal but still it's such a tax that people are not creating a lot of business use cases because of this tax uh law but with the presence of all of that it became very difficult to understand that okay what kind of entities and organizations can really accept crypto right so that's where a platform is needed so another number 73% of uh people who want to fund an impact they they have an inclination of funding and impact But ultimately 16% are only able to do that 57% have no clue exactly what is happening what kind of an impact they're able to whether measure or not what happens after three months do they know that how many children they were able to feed do they know that how many children they were able to teach or get taught right nothing none of that and this is not just retail how those institutions have a better have a have a have a more important you know uh Benchmark that's needed for them to understand what kind of an impact they were able to create and hence they need to again gear their funds for the next year or next quarter or next you know half a year all of these issues make an initiative underfunded but the problem is that whenever an initiative goes underfunded it's not not like if I'm getting I need a million dollars I'm getting 200k so I'll get 20% of the job done it doesn't work that way if you're getting 20% of the funds you're getting going to get zero work done because there's a minimum investment that's needed to get some activity some social activity some impact created right if you're getting maybe 10 or 20% of your fund requirement it's not like you're going to be able to so you won't be able to deploy any of your strategies so you cannot just create an impact in 20% of the farmers right that's that's nonsense so that's why an underfunded initiative is a huge issue so 80% such initiatives are underfunded that's where this platform comes in right the impact wave um so I founded this platform sometime back and uh what it does is it allows you to streamline your funds in a fashion where you do not need to pick specific uh uh organizations or entities to be able to uh give money to what happens is that there are vetted organiz organizations entities starting with Europe which vetted by the platform who are who who have certain requirements everything all on The Ledger now once you as a funer specify you just have to come on the platform and you have to specify that okay I want to invest in three different categories I want to fund three different impact causes one is Healthcare maybe 30% of my funds 20% to Children education and maybe you know remaining uh maybe two more causes or maybe one cause 50% to say biodiversity uh or or poverty or anything like that right you just tell the platform that this these are my preferences or these are my mandates maybe because as a corporate you might have certain mandates to uh to create uh to choose causes around a certain uh specific domain once you do that the platform would be able to now that's where the AI comes so the platform is going to decide that okay based on your kind of an investment you have a billion dollars worth of funds or $10 million a million do whatever it is you have what we're going to do is we're going to implement some AI blockchain is already there and we're going to tell you not even tell you we're just going to implement it deploy your funds uh uh all open all transparent all credible on the blockchain to certain specific vetted organizations if you're not happy with it you get a chance to come and change your preferences and even at the end of the quarter you would automatically get a chance because you want to see the exact kind of an impact you able to create and that will tell you that okay no this is not working out maybe now I need to change the organizations or maybe I need to change my preferences from 30% to 50% on Healthcare or whatever it is right so that kind of an uh a a mixing that kind of a preference setting can be done maybe quarter to quarter based on your uh mandates and that's where blockchain and come in and that what they that's what they help you uh achieve right so with this just just by trying even as a retailer or as an Institutional lender just by able to do this using all of these features of course just try to imagine the kind of an impact you would be able to create globally right in the lives of millions these you have the funds it's not like you need to year mark separate funds you have the funds the institutions have the funds it's just that they're not reaching the right receivers and the problem is that it's not just because you maybe are working with the government and the government is corrupt and they are not eventually sending out the money they're all eating up the money it's not like that if that would have been the case it would have been a separate challenge to solve but because that is not the case then why what why is why are you getting hamstrung with this problem of Technology where technology can really help and help you create this kind of a an impact that's it so that's that's something that is is now in Europe and uh is we're going to go in other places as well uh but with that let's move on to the second story just to recap what we started with what why am I discussing two stories today not not specifically what impact Investments are or what nfts can do the idea is that how can we create social impact how can we create positive impact with Investments using blockchain technology using decentralized Finance all those Technologies nfts and how and and what kind of an impact we can create or what kind of use cases have already been creating such impact this was in fact uh my uh this has been my uh ethereum Foundation Fellowship uh project as well uh farmer financing Financial inclusion using blockchain technology public good use case using ethereum uh using ethereum um so that's that's where uh started in India with one brand which I founded in 2019 now working with a brand in Africa doing a very similar thing helping Farmers uh earn a lot of you know incremental income uh using blockchain technology so but again here a problem slide what are the problems that have been there number one indebtedness by the farmers taking a step back even before discussing the problems taking a step back why do why do we even need such a solution why do farmers what kind of problems are these Farmers facing right after harvesting a crop and I'm talking about 140 different crops that we've worked with in the past across both the continents 140 different crops which you can store in a warehouse these are all non-p perishable crops and you can take a loan against you can pledge these crops this is the model right just to get everyone on the same page the model is that you can take a loan against your crop say you have 500 quintals of U rice or soyab bean corn whatever it is right you want to take a loan against it you can using blockchain technology so that's what the premise is now why do you even need that because as a farmer you've been facing these problems adverse weather conditions indebtedness a lot of intermediaries in between eating up your margins you know all of these problems High agricultural cost a farmer deals with so many problems right so those are our problems now these problems ultimately result into a lot of suicides can someone guess I have 10 more minutes can someone guess uh in India over a time period of 15 years how many farmers might have committed suicides I'll tell you the period 95 to 2010 that's a good data that I got I mean not a good data but I mean that's a data I got any clue 5,000 anyone else 50001 50002 50003 anyone else yeah we should not be doing that uh any other number in India 100,000 that's a big number right 100,000 what about Africa the entire African continent any clue any number so for India I've got two numbers for Africa much bigger place a million okay all right okay maybe not a million that's a that's a lot okay so yeah so these are the these are these are the grave numbers that's how grave the situation is more than 75 million plus Farmers committed suicides in Africa the entire African continent between that period That's the period data I got um we can extrapolate it simply and for India much lesser so you know 0.3 million actually uh is what the Indian numbers are now these are very Ser this is a very serious issue okay um you would see that in in you know there are there are occurrences I have a slide on that at the end I have a photo to share there are occurrences when people Farmers have gone to the market getting Pennies on the dollar for every kilogram of crop that they took eventually it was not even enough they can't get it back right so what they had to do is they had to throw maybe 100 200 Quints of potatoes rice or whatever it is on the road the reason is that bringing it back to their Hometown to their home which is maybe a few hundred kilometers away is going to be much more pricier than just throwing it there right zero profit zero profit zero income is still fine not negative right after 4 months of harvesting that's why this use skilles become so important so with ethereum Foundation also what you know we've tried to do is because ethereum's entire mandate was how to reach the next billion so what better place to do that than India which has a 1.4 billion population and a lot of it is Farmers right a huge it's a very huge agricultural Market some Africa numbers more than 33 million farmers are small holder and marginal Farmers uh these have 2 to four hectares of land probably uh 80% have do not have any collateral for these loans this is the second part of the loan right one is you can easily use your crops as collateral other is that if you do not have a collateral for a loan then what you do right again blockchain technology comes to rescue and uh with presence of such credible and transparent data it becomes very easy for banks to underwrite these loans right and this is the point where blockchain technology helps us connect Farmers with not just Banks bringing banks on board as notes onto a permission blockchain um like kodum also connect the same network with a D5 protocol on say polygon um and enabling the same farmer to take a loan from the decentralized finance pools as well defi lenders also so the farmers are able to tap into two different sources of loan where previously they had none or maybe one which was which was not good right um just to give you an example the rate usually the farmers get is more than 30 35% interest per anom with this kind of a technology what we've been able to achieve is less than 9% per anom that's a huge gap right with a 30 35% interest rate Farmers go further into indebtedness rather than coming out of it so it's it's a no-brainer solution here right so that's what so this is a brand that has been working in Africa uh to do this and they've been using blockchain technology Dy nft so where does nft come from so we'll we'll we'll come to that very shortly another statistic is that oneir of the entire food uh produced across uh globally uh only 1/3 gets eaten right uh 1/3 never actually gets eaten 1/3 gets wasted and more than $1 trillion worth of total food is wasted that's that's actually equivalent to $1 trillion worth of total food wasted right all the more reason to bring this credibility and transparency onto the blockchain yeah so this is the photograph I was talking about you can see that people had to waste food on the roads rather than taking it it back this wastage is not because of weather right so people can claim that there are other problems that farmers face but this is not those right this is purely indebtedness this is purely not getting enough margins not getting enough uh cost on your produce not even getting 0.1% of what you what you put into it right so that's not not healthy right that's not healthy so how many of you own an nft of course many probably everyone how many of you own an nft okay just what 3 four come on guys uh right just that's it okay so when did you get your first nft which year maybe this year how about you okay three years back anyone else who else raised their hands 18 okay so she she's an outlier in my story okay anyone else okay so 2020 2020 23 22 largely all of us here who do not have an nft anyway out of the question who have an nft owned an nft minted an nft did so in 2020 so I'm so happy to share that my farmers in India and Africa owned an nft even before un I did I I think I I minted my first one on openc in 2019 to be honest so 19 is when we also started so I can assume that farmers my Farmers got an nft and what is this nft they don't know they have no clue they have no clue they own an nft it's in their phones right it's on an a multilingual Android app on their phones but they have no clue what is an nft this NF actually just for the sake of it I put nft here it's actually and sft and ERC 1155 this sft semi fungible token represents their entire produce at the in the at the warehouse actual produce stored at the warehouse so this is a real world asset tokenization so if a farmer has 300 Quints of rice that would be tokenized onto the blockchain as an sft all that all of that with all the characteristics because such things you know crops have a lot of characteristics so which year which month which season in like in India there is karif and rabi and all these things every country has their own uh Seasons so all of those add up to characteristics of a of a crop or of a piece of crop or a you know deposit of crop and then the quintal or the kilog why an sft because it has to have fungible and non-fungible values both uh as and as a crop as a deposit by a farmer the farmer needs to be able to act on a partial portion of that crop as well today they might not even want to pledge 500 Quints of rice maybe 300 Quints of rice so that's where sft comes into play so that's the kind of you know story we have been able to build um you know as a uh you know completely in a very nonprofit way uh and that to using blockchain technology nfts uh and decentralized finance to create a major shift in the lives of uh farmers in India Africa and then other initiatives other impact initiatives starting now in places like Europe so yeah so that's how we use these Technologies to make this happen so that's it largely you know I think I'm right on time uh that's it so the agenda today was again to recap sharing two stories with you non-technical completely because they were farmer stories definitely starts non-technical and how this kind of a technology can be used at such a uh uh you know level at such uh levels uh to create such huge amazing impacts so that's it largely any questions any questions yes the blue t-shirt there I think we have 2 minutes yeah Joe oh no we have 10 minutes that that's watch is fast okay so I have 10 minutes hello hello uh hi abish uh actually I uh for your second case study right uh actually I'm just wondering how you apply the nft and the and the crypto into the loan lending case study is it like you're using nft to link to the farmer profile so that the bank can access to the nft and check on the farmer profile on how much their land can produce the food so that they are able to access their profile and provide the loan for them and for the second one is it like the bank will need to connect with the crypto wallet so that the defi Community can can directly use their crypto uh to to donate the their money through the through the bank system and then directly donate to the Farmers is it is it what you are trying to say okay I hope I remember the questions so I'm so happy that you asked these two questions specifically they help me they allow me to delve deeper into and considering that I have the time to do so they help me to delve deeper much deeper into you know what the use cases are about so the first question is that uh whether the kind what kind of you know how how the nft comes into play when giving loan right and whether the banks have to connect to what can you come again on that yeah right so a very interesting point there is that uh the crypto part of it so kind of answering the second question also with this right the crypto part of it the def5 part of it runs very separately very differently as compared to the uh the Fiat part of it right the bank so there is a permission Network what the bank needs to do is the bank is just a part a node on the permission Network and so are the government custodians or the warehouses where the actual crops are stored and so are any other third parties who become a part of this entire ecosystem at this moment they have no relation to crypto right and that is why that is possible to be honest so uh you know without taking the name because uh that particular use case I've already left but this is what was started in India in 2019 um I'll just give you an an idea of how that happens how that works that part of Fiat loan right fiat currency loan was based out of India because you can do that in India right the moment we connected that with the D5 part it had to be that that D5 part had to be based out of not I mean outside of India right it was based in SVG St Vincent and gardines I'm not sure if you've heard about it they offer such regular tion and and jurisdictions so they don't mix up at any point in time right the bank is not working with the defi at all otherwise I don't think that would be possible and that is why for the first 3 years this defi did not exist and it was only a permission Network the moment D5 came into picture we got in polygon we got in you know uh probably other players who are important to this particular site and then all of them worked together but the bank specifically does not go into defa or the defa doesn't come into bank number one secondly the bank you mentioned that the bank does the bank have access to the profiles yes they do for that we do not need the nft that automatically is because the Farmer account is created on the on the blockchain right we do not store personally identifiable information on the blockchain obviously uh but we still have to be a kind of a web 2.

5 solution in this so that we can achieve those Enterprise goals right maybe without being 100% decentralized but also not being centralized okay because the bank might not support 100% decentralized all right or or or Anonymous specifically in fact uh the a credit rating agency Experian they also once got in touch with us because such profiles for Farmers don't exist so that's a very good idea because we have a credit score right based on which we get our credit cards bank accounts Etc the farmers don't have a credit score not in India not in many other places so those that credit rating agency because of our solution use case wanted to build with us a credit rating for Farmers which is when if that happens I has it happened yet if that happens then that would make sense of you know giving access to the farmer profile and knowing its entire background of of you know borrowing and and all those financial activities is there a part of the question which I did not answer the second part how does the yeah so how does the defy lending work is that what you're asking so okay I'm not understanding the last part can you give him the mic right okay so how does a defi technology help in the lending right so it's a defi loan that's what the defi technology right so and how does it work so what happens is the bank the same nft once it's tokenized on the permission blockchain the moment the farmer says that I want to take a loan on the polygon blockchain from a D5 pool which is by the way the same you know the pool just set up outside of India uh without adding any other third party pools just talking about the main pool set up by the organization itself the moment he does that that nft that tokenized nft is immediately shifted to polygon basically bridged to polygon and then they have the same access the defi lenders have the same access to that nft like Bank did maybe two seconds back when it when the farmer did not take such a decision right and when that happens uh what what the uh defi lender does is basically so there are bonds which are created so these bonds are real world asset uh backed bonds Emerging Market asset backed bonds these bonds are what the defi lenders invest into and that money goes to the farmer as d as uh the loan coming from the D5 and that happens in crypto only yet so no off- ramping Done Yet Fiat is separate this crypto is separate so this is largely applicable to a bit bigger traders who are able to accept crypto loans at this moment but soon it'll be an off-ramp solution as well so that even if you're not a big uh person big uh Trader or a farmer you can still accept loans we'll just give you it in fat in your bank account so that's how it works so that's how that's bridged yeah any other question there were other questions as well right yeah thank you a lovely yes yeah yeah please go continue I think maybe since is a for yeah yeah right yeah thank you for explaining uh how the defi U Landing protocol works in your project um I would like to know if um a liquidity a provider perspective um you mentioned that there is a real world uh tokenization for the collateral provided by the farmer so um I would like to know is that a governance step and how do uh the liquidity provider understand the quality of the collat that you that for the liquidity to be provided to that particular Farm yeah good good followup question right thank you again um so how it works is that you remember when I was discussing the Fiat side of things the permission side of things I mentioned that that are are third parties who are also on boarded as nodes on the blockchain network so these third parties are called collateral management agencies what they do is they visit in a blind kind of a mechanism they don't have access to the actual receipt the the warehouse receipt what we call it could not get time to Del so much deeper but that's what's called whr Warehouse receipt so they don't have access to that so they have to visit the warehouse and they have to do their uh independent analysis of the crop and because this is a very physical business with physical custodians you know uh a good number of custodians more than than 14,500 custodians when I was running that Indian platform uh in one state in India 1400 warehouses or custodians so it's a very physical business the custo the uh collateral management agency needs to visit them create an entire report and that report is also put on the blockchain so just and that report is accessible by the bank also before giving the loan similarly that report is available to the uh to the defi lenders before giving a loan to understand that okay what kind of a crop are we investing in so the crop it the details comes that okay this is the nft uh 500 Quints of rice this season this variety this grade U you know MOA content this that 18 different parameters all packed into a report and shown on the blockchain and uh this is what the bond represents right and this bond is maybe uh it's a zero coupon bond for example for the next 3 months or maybe it January 2024 so this is what the data that uh the defi uh lenders get access to and then they decide whether I want to invest donate in I mean put liquidity in this platform or not once they do they get bound with all those uh Bond uh specifications and regulations yeah did they answer the question okay okay thank you yes maybe last question because all right um so those two questions are regarding your second um initiative so my questions for your first initiative lovely um just for me to understand um what's the thinking behind targeting the mass Market um for you to uh to work on that and why tapping into the uh blockchain technology what can what can impact wave do that a web tool for example you imagine like a change.org um that they can have like you know pulling of different organizations under it and whatnot and then you put money into it and then they can give it to anyone who pass um their cohorts right so what's the difference between that and that the model that I just mentioned right to simplify a question it is that what can we not do with without blockchain technology where we are using blockchain technology maybe to simplify the question is that what okay it didn't simplify it made it complex all right okay so just to make it concise so in fact we started as a web2 company right we did not have the use of blockchain Technology at all because this problem came into the lives you our lives you know earlier on before we started thinking about using blockchain technology for it right then there were a lot of validations that happened and and why this industry is not working why this you know why this what is a core problem and that core problem was transparency right two ways transparency number one is the investment is made that is one that is important because you as an institution or a retailer you're providing your money or putting in your money so how much transparent is that second transparency Factor was that what happens at the end of three months how I'm not even able to understand what is the kind of impact I'm able to create so that's not measurable and that is very important may not be for retailers but retail people but it is very important for institutions who have to have reports shown to them that exactly how many students they helped uh study or how many people they fed right so that kind of a report that's where we got validation a lot of validation from investors also the investors we have in discussion with that blockchain technology can be used yes you have a follow up something yes yeah all right um in that case it seems it sounds like it's it's it's a very uh full like it's almost as equivalent of having you know auditing the the organization itself yeah um why don't you consider that I mean would have you considered working with institutions instead of directly working with retail markets because won't you add a layer of complexity to them whereas when you work with retailers with with institution then you so institutions is no institutions is our first customer we have to work with institutions right working with institutions just working with plain and simple institutions does not solve the problem of transparency that the institutions are themselves facing right the use of technology is just a vehicle uh to make that happen right that's the same problem that institutions are already facing even before we are there or even before they have have started uh investing you know via US via the platform right so institutions are our first customer we have to work with institutions retailers are technically you know come they come second for us right so institutions are anyway important but that's not what we're trying to solve with blockchain the problem that they solve while doing such Investments with or without us is what blockchain solves did that answer question somewhat yeah okay thank you yeah all right thank you any more questions yeah because it's anyway the last session of the day and that that that watch is very fast yeah I was looking at that while my talk was going on any more questions from FL since this is the last talk so you can you know yeah actually you have an opportunity to ask questions if you want yes yeah the first story yeah I think because uh personally I looked into like how blockchain can do social impact as well a little bit and I think the the the thing that didn't really click to me is that how did you track it end to at the end part of how you spend it yeah not 100% actually you know just to happy to share it here that the first part where the funds are coming from the givers to the receivers is 100% tracked the second part is something that is still a challenge which we're trying to solve 100% but not always it's possible because there are certain initiatives or there are certain activities where uh an initiative has to spend right at a very Ong ground level maybe in very lower amounts of cash just to give you a real ground example which is not practical to be you know dragged on blockchain so that's the still that 2 to 4% or 5% or 7% sometimes that increases sometimes in in the size uh the kind of problem the challenge that we are not able to solve with blockchain 100% but we're still trying to make the institutions happy that okay earlier it was 0% what you were getting the clarity now it's at least you know 85% 90% 92% sometimes that way you know if number of based on the number of transactions and how much we able to track so that's a very good question which we are not 100% able to solve yet but let's see where we go with that for the that second part of it the first part 100% solved right that's all all on blockchain all right any other questions we understand there's no hurry today but questions hi um I'm Eric um hi Eric I don't really understand some of it but um just share some experience with me with myself and then to see whether any connections yeah um I planted Japanese strawberry in Indonesia so I'm quite into Agriculture and I got a friend that we are supposed to work together but haven't okay uh they I hope that works yeah they they have they're doing in farming consultation in SLE okay um each project is like 5,000 farmers and things like that but the issue in Africa is or Ora is that uh when you need Farmers it doesn't mean that you just go to the farm and get Farmers they have like a lot of communities Corporation or whatever they may have only 3% they may have 100% then they dispatch or send one farmer each season or if they have two seasons together they may send two or or or four person to share at one season then they start with a cop and then you know get a harvest and things like that um they don't have money they don't have the credit as you said so uh the World Bank they get a credit from the World Bank but the World Bank cannot give direct to them so they will have to give to the local banks and the local bank give the loan correct a lot of very primitive very traditional way and you come into you know all this blockchain that um actually I'm working on the T blockchain which is on telegram not the etherum though so I was thinking like how it can be integrated but you seem to have come to a stage where you can integrate the things already yes so I'm not sure which part you know yeah uh that can be done but I thought yeah this is quite a big yeah so Eric this is the exactly the kind of problem that can be be solved with such approach right in fact to share with everyone as Eric said that the farmer cannot receive a loan help support directly from the World Bank so what happens is the World Bank gives to the local banks and the local banks further deploy the money to the farmers this is exactly what in the Second Story you saw so in India same story same world Bank coming into the picture deploying the funds but we do not work directly with the World Bank so what has to happen is exactly the same the World Bank has to give to say Maharashtra Regional Cooperative Bank like in state of Maharashtra and then there are thousands of farmers in Maharashtra who are receiving it from the regional bank right and we have solved it right on blockchain so that's exactly what's happening I think this is then for the each individual that you can give the loan thing uh Africa seems to still they don't have phone to hold on it no actually not I mean you know so this is a very interesting concept that Eric has shared uh you know uh Joe we have time right 2 minutes four minutes more yeah so uh thank you for everyone for still sitting here so um we had the same thought even while deploying the solution in India and when we were designing it um we were astonished to see our own stats that how many of our farmers in India were using finally eventually using the smartphone and the app on their phone so we had created an alternative model also where the farma could just walk into the warehouse and take the warehouses help right a huge portion of the farmers actually were using and very comfortable with using the smartphone and the app on their phone which really OD us right in Africa it is also the problem is not how you think it is right in fact things have changed for example m in Africa right they're able to work on even on very featured phones they don't need smartphones right so there are so many you know approaches to this where we have seen that even very little amount of technology and a bit of awareness on the farmers end has actually made this uh work and and that's that's fantastic to I mean I would be happy to share some statistics with you they're doing really good work in Africa where they're able to access those Farmers even though we think that farmers are not very teex they're not Tech heavy they don't need to be Tavy actually uh they actually didn't have phones and they use points system so individually they go and collect the points and they get their now it's changing right I think yeah quite a lot but it's still going on now yeah maybe to yeah would would be happy to look at that as well and would be happy to share that the kind of numbers I've seen happen I'm not worked in Africa directly I mean we have worked with that organization but I've know that the challenge is not going away thank you for sharing thanks thanks Eric yeah thank you for such interest interesting question yeah wonderful um any more questions from the fls yeah or if abish has any more to share no nothing much please feel free to connect that's my LinkedIn the QR code is for my LinkedIn I'm very active on LinkedIn please feel free to connect if you have any blockchain solution which is anywhere close to this right we always looking for partners right we are always looking for entities and organizations and and even even individual developers and other people to partner with so that's the best place to go we would love to have a chat please hit me up on LinkedIn and that's the best way to go itad yeah thank you so much for being an a a wonderful audience thank you Round of Applause for ab for sharing such an impactful sharing