People's Choice: 10-Minute Lightning Talks & Panel

there you go hey we got it good morning uh thank you for coming it's a a great day today after we had the snow yesterday so I'm having a bit of a morning um the AT&T is not working uh and I would normally take a scooter to get here um but I I just want to give a quick shout out to a very nice denverite named Emily uh who I caught a ride with this morning uh just randomly picked me up in front of the source so I could get here on time so thank you Emily okay hi uh I'm zerox Joshua I'm one of the board members for for spor Dow uh this year uh what we did uh was we wanted to decentralize a little bit of the content so we held a People's Choice Awards um and what we did was we we we used joke race and we allow listed anybody who held at least one buff aorn one Spork or one steak Spork to vote we had a number of really good submissions uh and then about 40 something people voted so that was it was a really exciting uh first test into what we are hoping to expand into a larger program next year for decentralizing more of the content uh so hopefully the people of e Denver chose uh some very talented speakers uh the content of which should be enthralling um so the format for this morning we're going to have uh five 10-minute lightning talks and then we're going to be joined around depending on timing around 11:10 11:15 uh for a panel uh hosted by Griff green uh so I'm going to turn the first panel the first lightning talk over to HRI you can come on up he's getting his slides ready again thank you so much for tuning in this morning this is going to be some great content all right knock him dead all right thanks Joshua so let me allow it can you see the slides yeah everybody so uh [Music] continue keyboard uh identify your your keyboard yeah perfect okay yeah so well oh I can just sit uh anyway if it's fine so okay today we're going to discuss a broader Vision to decentralize any blockchain interaction and thanks uh to the public to having voted for for that Vision so we talked a lot about frames uh recently in the last weeks so and frames are super cool it's a way to put transaction and embed them anywhere however if we look at the architecture behind it we find that in the protocol each of these frames in fact should point to a frame server and that makes a lot of these frame servers which many teams will just put on centralized Services because this is somehow convenient so we end up creating much many more uh centralized instances and usually one for each frame so it's not censorship resistant and uh it's not distributed and it's not decentralized what if we could do this which is basically building a decentralized frame Network which powers these frames that would be cool no and while we add it we can do much more than farcaster we can do frames on farcaster we can do widgets that we can insert into any web pages or mobile we can do in smart contracts that you can call directly from Discord or telegram or other socials we can do more this is the decentralized vision that we want to but yeah let's look at the technical details on how we achieve that right now you can decentralize using ens pointing to ipns pointing to ipfs and this is usually what is done for many projects which are using e. limo but if you look closely at the source code of these web pages they point to some centralized apis and these centralized apis are a problem because if for whatever reason the team uh especially smaller one lose Focus Shift to another product uh don't pay the monthly AWS bill then this API disappears and the whole front end becomes totally inoperative it's also much easier to censor uh them so when we deploy smart contracts they are decentralized and if we can decentralize the storage of the front end on ipfs we can do that but the problem is the API and that's a greata left for another talk about the rpcs themselves so what can we do could we make a network where we basically ask many different people to have their own copy of the front end deployed on ipfs and then they run their old set of decentralized nodes here and there uh yeah but soon we'll see that will end up with multiple copies which might be not the same version maybe someone is running version 1 the other one is running 1.2.1 Etc and it becomes a total mess that will be very hard to to maintain such a distributed Network we need trust that's the second concept here so how can we trust frontends basically we know in this architecture we need to trust the URL or the ipfs domain we need to trust the API and we need to trust the RPC but even more importantly we need to trust the front end implementation itself and this is a bit of a problem let's look at a very well implemented uh front end for uniswap for instance V2 add liquidity we don't go into details in this quick talk but there's a lot of code in there a lot of opportunities to make mistakes leveraging a lot of different libraries that evolve in time and that may rot a bit if they're not actively maintained that's a problem to trust the frontend code is complex there are lots of dependencies and if you are an auditor because you need to audit more than your contracts you also need to audit your front end it's hard to verify all these code bases it's hard to maintain we believe that the third concept and the last one in this talk which is minimalism is the answer to this so how do we apply minimalism here when we look at the implementation of front ends we'll see that they are monoliths of compiled GS and there are just tiny bits of these monolith which are highlighted in color in in this schema which are the semantics and which matters the rest is just fer code and lots and lots of them what if we could find a way to build a common implementation of front ends where we can have the specification itself which is the semantics which is nicely put together and all the boiler plates being a single Un unique engine to run them that's the vision of minimalism and we can even extend this to generate the UI automatically to save time for developers and as well to make sure that we need to audit the generator just once and then don't have to audit all the differ projects one by one this leads us to what is the specification what is the interaction semantics and this is what we've done at okay contract working for almost three years now on how to solve this problem with a computer science approach and that led us to introduce a purely functional specification DRS cell for transactions that we call lamb descript and the beauty of it is we replace hundreds or thousands of JavaScript code by very short and prec prise description of the semantics and when we have this then we can have a unique runtime that runs that specification for that transaction or many other transaction indeed all of them this is like the separation of the specification and the run time it small amount of code easy to verify and the single common client runtime is open source and and we releasing we started releasing all the packages that are behind it today the first of them being Sals which could be another talk which I'm giving on Thursday at Le B2B and that single common client runtime can have multiple audits because if hundreds thousands of interaction depend on them it's worth uh securing and verifying it properly so those were the three concepts in this lightning token we want decentralization we want trust and we believe that the only way to achieve this is through minimalism and that echoing what the architecture that we show initially is what we're are building now it's an interaction Network a decentralized network that can power the UI interaction the front end interaction for web mobile foraster Discord telegram everything so and this is how basically we can create as many interaction may it be defy nft gaming there's truly No Limit because it's a Pur incomplete language which basically can express any kind of transaction so what's the next step how can we contribute how can you contribute to making that a reality so first you'll be able to play with the SDK really soon we'll release it next month that will be at okay contract SDK so both on GitHub of course and on npm and if you're a project if you're a chain let's make it this reality let's make decentralized front end may call them alternative front ends because they may be another way to access rather than the dabs and maybe one day they'll become the default front ends for every transaction so thanks a lot if you want to follow us we are at okay contract on X Twitter uh and uh you can also scan the QR code here if you want to join our telegram group where many things will be announced in the weeks the months and the years to come thanks a lot is it all right thank you so much uh next we have uh Joshua tan from metov thanks Josh all right let's hope this works it's uh asking me to identify my keyboard give me one second say again I'm just trying to get this thing turned you got it all right all right Perfect all right hey folks I'm Josh uh founder of medov and uh lead at dowar I'm going to take you uh well so I'm a researcher in Dow's community self-governance and what I wanted to share today was a few projects we've been doing at medov but maybe let me just give you a little bit of context first so here is a post that I uh actually posted almost two years ago in 2022 called a long bet for Dow and the key idea here is that the BET as it were is that by 2032 so about eight years from now Dows and other forms of other digitally constituted organizations will own and operate over 50% of the US economy just imagine that for a second what would it take for us to get to 50% that's like trillions of dollars of the entire economy can you imagine today's Dows doing anything like that competing with organizations at that scale for most people the answer is no but I think there are a lot of reasons why you think it might be possible I'm not going to go into all the reasons why but I what I want to sort of put in front of you why I want to sort of contextualize this is that if we want Dows to take over 50% of the entire economy we're going to need to invest in some actually like really deep investments into the Fe underlying feature set of dows we need to make them actually competitive with traditional corporations and to do that we need to invest in science which is why some of my collaborators and I have released a project just recently about a couple months ago called Dow science so if you go to Dow science.org which just Google Dow science this is effectively a large 80-page survey of what of The Cutting Edge in Dow research we have everything from mechanisms is done to voting designs to granular privacy Primitives to actually just like legal Innovations to make Dows cheaper easier to run and more effective so this is a large collaborative effort I'll just name some of my collaborators and co-authors including let's get close uh Tara MK from cnrs Sarah hubber from Harvard Eliza from Yale and many others including Dan Bonet Ari jwes Michael zarum Jason pots and so on it's like a really large multi-author work trying to sus out the future and then sort of what we need to get to the future of dows so whether you're a computer scientist interested in as I mentioned privacy Primitives private execution new sorts of computational substrates or you're an economist you're interested in asking the basic question of well what is the institutional economics of dows what are the underlying let's say uh transaction costs for Dows and how do they compare with traditional corporations this paper SL this larger Community website will help get you up to speed on what are the true open problems and Dows and how you can contribute to that underlying feature side so it's intended not only for researchers but also for practitioners and people who are building Dow tools share a little bit oh uh and if you're interested in just reading the actual paper so this is the uh on archive open problems in Dallas as I mentioned in the 80-page survey paper on everything that is going on in Dow research today really encourage you to take a look uh while I'm here also mention uh a lot of the work that's going on through downstar so uh medov uh sponsors a project called dowar which is effectively the standards body for Dows at orted by 80 plus organizations key organizations in the Dow ecosystem including ethereum Foundation optimism Aragon nosis radical and uh snapshot and many of the other main Frameworks uh main contributors to the Dow ecosystem uh this is something that we're going to officially launch uh actually at a later event this afternoon at the G toin house but we've just released a grants management standard uh in collaboration with gcoin uh where we're basically trying to allow all the different gr programs across web 3 from optimism retr pgf to getcoin to salana to the ethereum foundation we're trying to build a common infrastructure so that the data across these different grants and Grant applications can be shared and what that means for you is that pretty soon we're going to have more effective Grant Administration and we're going to have a common application for Grants so if you want to apply for money across these different ecosystems you'll be able to do that with just by filling out one application and it just goes everywhere there's a lot of other benefits too for example uh reducing Grant farming reducing double dipping and also helping people build a kind of interoperable reputation based on the grants that they've actually received across multiple ecosystems this is something that already happens uh to a small degree but we want to make sure this actually scales to all the ecosystems of crops web 3 anyways I'm really excited about what's going to be happening there and looking forward to uh I guess the official announcement later this afternoon and uh lastly I guess since I have your time I'll just mention briefly uh this project we're running called uh a bank for Dows this is literally my hackathon project it's not really I'm not actually submitting it into the e hackathon at least uh at least for now uh but this is uh the idea here is you know if you look at what exists out there in terms of the Dows today you know there's really like two kinds of main Dows there's like the giant ones like Unis swap maker and then there are small casual Dows like Spa Dow or sauna da or dinner da you know more like Social Clubs there's very very few what we think of as like Mom and Pop dows dows that you know are look like traditional businesses that that have a regular income stream why is that why are we missing this entire category of essentially the economy why are we missing 65 5% of the US economy in some sense well partly it's because the financial infrastructure for these small businesses just simply doesn't exist in web 3 web 3 is mostly like if you look at how people get money in web 3 they get it through VC they get it through native tokens which are effectively kind of like a very complicated and sophisticated crowd raise or they get it through grants and we're doing work on all three of these uh uh at medo we're doing research on all three of these kinds of res kinds of financial infrastructure but there's really a missing piece of infrastructure that we think of as just a normal Community Bank that's what I'm trying to build in the next three to four days so if you're around uh you see a big bald Asian guide running around with a red sweater or metag shirt please come by I would love to build this with with the community and uh yeah check out at bankford Dallas I literally just put this up two days ago okay uh I think that's it for me uh is there uh Josh I think you're you're back up thanks everyone great one thanks Josh okay next we have uh Arena from uh bbox and a fun fact we used bidbox last year for the E Denver Bon welcome her to the stage thanks Josh welcome everyone to eth Denver I'm so excited to be back just going to plug in here for y'all sorry can I can I just see can I just get a hand on um displaying I was try I was trying oh uh okay welcome um I'm here to talk about hackathons as the ultimate super modular game and so I'm Arina I run bidbox with uh my co-founder Vice who's in Norway who couldn't be with us today and some of our amazing Global team some of whom are here feel free fre to find us um I was formerly The General Counsel over at gitcoin um and at Super modular which was a successor Venture regen Studio prior to that I taught crypto law to JD MBA CS students at Cornell Tech and so had the privilege of um collaborating creating a lot of Open Spaces that were really multi-disciplinary that informed a lot of how I think about Innovation today and before that I spent a lot of time in private practice as a lawyer um at places like the World Bank and the SEC when it was a very different place uh than the one we know today so let's start with super modularity has anyone heard of super modularity great then hopefully you'll get to learn something today um super modularity is this notion that there uh it's basically tantamount to network effects so the idea that 1+ 1 equals three the contributions that ACR to a network um as more and more contributions acre the value is much greater than the sum of its parts and so these are really positive sum collaborative spaces right uh some examples might be transport rails software features or software features acrew you know platforms become stickier and more hospitable to more users um opening up sort of a Cambrian explosion of possibility social networks of course uh neural networks work in the same way so value acrel multiplies on itself almost quadratically uh the more multidisiplinary contribution there is and what's important or or good takeaway or good way to think about this is if you step back at least from my perspective as a lawyer and think about the basic set of social coordination protocols that we live under I.

E the law um property law is really it starts out with a notion of excludability so private property in contrast to public property are Goods or or property that you can exclude others from accessing and so Innovation prior to the digital age um was easy to circumscribe right and to protect and in fact intellectual property law is basically based on the notion that you would exclude access to a certain invention to protect the Monopoly of that inventor over time and to sort of allow them to recoup their benefit but as we spend more and more time online and as we continue to build public rails especially in web 3 that um are for everyone's enjoyment those Notions of property law don't always map really well to Innovation that's happening in web 3 and so um a good way to think about it in my mind is what might be the right tool to incent that kind of behavior and innovation in web 3 not withstanding um some of the protections that might be absent in the offline world and in my mind hackathons are that one of those great tools hackathons are an amazing way to contribute out of the box um not withstanding maybe absence of technical knowhow it's the best way to under very limited time constraints find a team collaborate with folks deliver an MVP um and really contribute to the space and find your footing and so I just wanted to sort of illustrate a little bit of why that is right time constraints Force MVP building you have really short deadlines um that Force teams to experiment with different ideas and solutions um fostering creativity and Innovation right you have this rapid development stage it's super concentrated you're only there a few hours or a few days we actually had the privilege of running e Denver last year and saw this front and center um that focuses your attention on a particular problem and speeds up that rapid development Innovation for Builders of all backgrounds you get the benefit of applying your practical skills and experience to a team in a real world scenario that um gives you amazing experience and is s such an easy way to go from0 to one both from a legitimacy perspective but also meeting people networking um which sort of carries over into the other benefit that you get to community build at the same time so you're collaborating with a diverse set of skill sets um it it's a great networking opportunity within open source overall and that competition that you get to participate in drives real outcomes so does anyone know any of these logos any of them recognizable great yeah so Aragon chain link XD um uni of course balancer a these were all born out of hackathons a lot of the so-called unicorns that we know about in web 3 we're born in a super concentrated time boxed event called a hackathon and it just goes to show how powerful that collaboration environment and that open collaborative space is to creating positive sum gains um and this just goes to show on the flip side where ecosystems have already transcended let's say to Z to one phase and are looking to a crew talent to continue to build and ideate and you know sort of foster that Cambrian explosion of utility that we really really want to see especially from a legal perspective especially from the perspective of um there might be there might be too much noise um really just helping sus out the signal from the noise and ecosystems hackathons are a great way to do that um and we know from our experience we for example just ran the um Alo on arbitrum hackathon um but these are some examples from some of our hackathons that saw really marked um impact subsequent to the hackathon of folks building on those sdks and so these are really impactful for ecosystems as a time box tools to get real results and that's why we love them and for us they're really are Flagship offering but we are bidbox itself is a broader deal Solution that's focused on ecosystem growth overall um so this is just a little bit about us in case you haven't heard of of us because we have rebranded from gitcoin hacks to bidbox we are built for bu for Builders and um through the many iterations that we've had in the space we've had the privilege of contributing to and seeing a lot of the growth in the e space and we are here to um to carry forward those learnings um across web 3 more broadly and so to date we've run over 160 hackathons we have over 36,000 builders on platform um that have deployed over 177,000 projects and uh have distributed over 10 million in prizes and so a lot of meaningful impact over time um and we hope that you'll consider building with us and building a more open web thanks for joining me thank you that was wonderful okay now we're going to have a do you want to you good it okay all right next up we have cup of Joseph from open dollar this is going to be a great one I put my laptop is there a stand uh right here oh okay all right I got a Podium last time so bear with all right so thank you so much for being here everybody a great crowd coming out to eth Denver this morning uh so happy to be here on the main stage uh presenting H the The People's Choice uh fire talks so thanks for having me and thank you to zerx Joshua for uh inviting me and encouraging me to apply uh and for Dow delegates uh or Dow token holders from spor da for voting uh for my talk so today uh I'm going to talk about the difference between contributing to Dows and contributing to your local government a little bit about me I'm Joseph shizzy I'm one of the co-founders of open dollar we're an over collateralized stable coin on arbitrum that makes uh lending more flexible in defi um I've been a contributor to openc consensus gitcoin um metac cartel raid Guild and other Dows over the years and uh you can follow me at Cupa Joseph on Twitter or farcaster um Mo many people at e Denver that I see every year don't know this about me but I'm also on one of the city council boards for the city that I live in uh with a focus on sustainability uh and I run a or help run a neighborhood organization called bike Falls Church in the city that I live in Falls Church uh and work on uh Street safety advocacy uh in my neighborhood right and uh so today uh my my opinions and things shown in this talk uh are personal represent me don't represent any of these organizations um and yeah are just on behalf of myself so A Tale of Two Cities well well A Tale of Two orgs um I think Dows are kind of like digital cities you know internet cities but today we're going to talk about these two in particular that I've contributed to metac cartel which is a molok dow one of the first uh real Dows in ethereum which uh supports public goods with Grant uh no strings attached grants uh and has given away millions of dollars to lots of projects in crypto uh and the other organization is bike Falls Church which is a neighborhood street safety advocacy organization in the city that I live in uh that goes to City Council meetings that um that grows our our uh neighborhood uh Power and clout in the neighborhood and in the city so that we can have more bike lanes and more uh Street safety and around dangerous intersections and come up with plans together to help kids get to school safely uh so so those are kind of the the missions of that and yeah let's let's compare and contrast so one of the my major takeaways from participating in local politics and participating in metac cartel and the other Dows that I have is this idea that politics is something that you do it's not something that you have and for most people most people are not active participants in their community and they're definitely not active participants in Dows right so so most people are on the sidelines and have opinions about things and have politics but they're not contributing to the outcome of those politics um and I think if you have goals or you have a strong opinion on some subject you should be getting involved or you should be actually exerting influence on those those subjects uh and I think most people especially Americans strongly underestimate the power that they have on their local surroundings and on the city or towns that they live in so if you uh if you want to influence a topic and a dow you go to the the Taco Town Hall in in the metac cartel Discord right you join you join the Discord you join local Town Halls on Twitter spaces right and if you want to influence a topic in your neighborhood uh we had a a Meetup for cyclists to discuss a potential new bike lane that we wanted to uh uh have put into the city while the road is being rebuilt so you can just go to the town hall and at every city council meeting in America your city council your mayor wherever you go is legally required to listen to you for at least a little bit and so I encourage everyone when you get home you know look up something that you care about in your neighborhood go figure out where your city hall is and just go there and and and just figure it out you can give public comments uh and when you get large groups of people to comment on things that are important to you you can have a really big change on your surroundings so setting goals is really important for the success of community advocacy groups and it's also really important for the success of dows most of the Dows that I've seen kind of um fizzle out over the last few years is because they didn't have a strong enough Manifesto they didn't have a strong enough goal that everyone was behind right and one of the reasons metac cartel had has uh uh you know kept going for so long is because the members uh everybody signs a Community First Manifesto to join and has this common goal of giving away all the treasury money to public goods or to the app layer to whatever you know we're giving money away to and participating together so we we have this uh you know Common Bond of of what we want to do and and a common uh a common slogan if you want to go fast go alone and if you want to go far go together uh and for bike Falls Church we are we have tons of goals we're actually tracking all of the Public Works projects in our County and in the neighboring County and uh coming up with little smile faces or frowny faces on how we feel about different things uh and it gives people things to Rally around so even if you're not in our organization if you see oh the street is being redone in front of my house or in front of my business and you learn that uh you are the city is asking for input from you you have the ability to to give input on how that road is redone on how walkable it is on how wide the sidewalks are and a bunch of things that you don't necessarily think about every day but actually greatly contribute to your quality of life so tracking those and tracking your goals and and having specific goals I think is essential to success in both so contributing contrib ruting to meta cartel is is going to the forums because there's some inperson events you know but uh the people who are doing the most are in the forums are reading are responding to each other and helping each other craft the most effective proposals to bring to the Dow right and for the city is a little different because the city has employees our Dow does not have full-time employees who are you know working on plans all the time so we want to support their policies influence their policies and we do that by going to Planning Commission meetings and City Council meetings like this one this is a picture of the uh Planning Commission in Fairfax County which um has the most tech workers of any County in America surprisingly there's an internet exchange there there's a lot of data centers lots of it folks work in Fairfax Virginia and it's over a million one million people population in Fairfax and despite that I go to plan Planning Commission meeting and there'll be less than 40 people maybe 30 25 even uh to give a com to give a public comment or exert influence on the Planning Commission members uh when they're about to take really important votes so this one that I took recently was um they were redoing the parking structure in Fairfax County which legally required 3.5 parking spaces to build a townhouse in Fairfax which is absurd uh and we were able to lower that to one parking space uh by having 40 people show up uh and and say hey this is something that we care about and as a result over the next 10 15 years which is how often they redo parking requirements that's going to be 1 million less parking spaces one imagine living in a city with 1 million more parking spaces or 1 million less parking spaces these small insignificant you know Thursday night meetings at 7:30 where only 30 people show up have huge impacts on the quality of life for millions of people and it's just there it's just there for you to reach out and and grab it and and exert influence and and have uh you know really positive effects on your community where even metac cartel you know uh is part of the internet and conect can connect to anyone globally but is crypto reaching that many millions of people I don't know so strategies on on growing an org and we I keep saying exert influence really that means how many people are coming to your meeting how many people are contributing to your Dow and for growing meta cartel uh it's ship posting on Twitter and for growing bike Falls Church it's ship posting in real life so we are uh putting up yard signs that's me actually um putting up yard signs along the bike trails that go through the city and and from spending $80 on yard signs we got more than 2% of the adult population of our city to sign up for our email list so more than 2% of everybody saw the yard signs or heard from a friend who saw it and and signed up and is now uh you know sending emails to city council and working on making our streets safer for our kids to get to school uh which is really incredible growth you know and so small growth hacks like that can mean a lot especially when you have an intimate connection with the people that are in your community um which I think makes you know meta cartel better too because we all have these shared goals and and we really care about the the future of dows and and crypto supporting public goods what does it look like uh public nouns funding public goods is a meta cartel affiliate offshoot um sending sending lots of uh uh no strings attached grants for quadratic funding for public goods and and public infrastructure on the internet but public goods are IRL too and uh it's really good for your soul to go pick up trash and remove it from your local River or from your your bike your bike trails uh and you get to to build great Community with with the people around you so both are fun tracking results is one of the most important parts and can be really hard I took this uh screenshot from uh gitcoin grants and so this was the results of of the last grant funding round and quadratic voting and and how many people participated uh which is great but it can often be difficult to see the actual fruits of your labor if you're not keeping up with all these hundreds of projects that are asking for Grants and and it's it's very difficult to to uh you know keep up with all that just just because we only have 24 hours in a day right um but when I contribute to bike Falls Church we were able to uh come up with a a new Safe Streets plan uh to to design roads and design bike routes to get kids to school and now we started a bike bus and we have 50 60 70 kids sometimes that all bike together down the street and we just completely take over the street getting kids to school and that is like so wholesome it is so rewarding to just ride my bike through my community and help kids get to school safely and give them the empowerment and freedom that comes with having Safe Streets that's it um please go contribute to public goods in your neighborhood not just ethereum infrastructure do that too but if you are a tech bro hanging out at eth Denver or watching this online uh if you are a a a governance nerd and and you're experimenting with new forms of governance on the internet bring some of that to your neighborhood bring some of that to your local community because you can probably have a much bigger effect on your environment and the safety of kids around you uh and and the people that you care about in your community than you think you can uh you are powerful and and go forth and and take that take that with you and do great things thank you I'm Joseph shizzy and and thanks for coming today thank you Joseph if if that didn't convince you to run for local office I don't know what will okay next we have uh David Phelps the founder of uh joke race who was um that the product that helped us to put on the People's Choice so he going to give a quick lightning talk on what it is that we did here and the future let's see if it connects all right oh look at this look at this there we go wow whoa whoa hi everyone uh packed house I know so excited excited seriously thank you for coming out on early in the morning after all the late nights here um I'm David um we are not going to allow this to connect um I want to I want to keep this casual um so you got questions I don't know shoot a hand up we can we can all chat we can talk um what want to talk about today is why I think every app in the future will be built on chain um and in fact uh this is a controversial thesis uh even if you look at a lot of the apps in web 3 they're not on chain even some of the ones that use a blockchain are building in ways that they're not even taking advantage of it um and they're having to you know especially if they're built in the app store they're having to do a lot of cartwheels and Maneuvers to try to get around um those App Store fees by avoiding a lot of what's actually possible on chain um so so uh as I said I'm I'm co-founder of joke race I'll use joke race as an example here um but I think uh I'll also be talking about some of the other apps that we work with um and why why we can unlock so so much more for Consumer app building when when we build on chain uh and I'm going to break this down to four parts really quickly so so I'll talk about monetization uh and monetary rails is the first part um then I'll talk about uh analytics and the power of onchain analytics I'll talk about reputation and finally I'll talk about extensibility um and explain what that means composability as well okay so let me let me start here this is a a page from our own um contest create uh crate contest flow um where you get to monetize a contest and you can monetize a contest by setting entry charges and voting charges um for anyone who participates in the contest um and the reason that I'm showing this really really simple page here is that this could not be done in web 2 um you could not have a page that looks like this in web 2 um and it's not just because these are denominated in eth um it's because we're actually building on the financial rails of a blockchain so when people are submitting and when people are voting they're actually using the blockchain itself which means they're paying they're paying gas fees and you can basically add fees into that in allinone transaction to allow um full monetization um and what that means is you know if you did this in web 2 what you'd have to do is you would have to set up a stripe account you have to integrate with the stripe account stripe would have to handle it um and you would then lose 2.9% fees if you did it in Mobile you would then lose additional 30% of fees to the App Store as well you don't lose 2.9% you don't lose 30% oh we're done I guess I'll be raw dogging this one um uh no it's fine um we'll figure it out we'll be right back uh so in in in web 3 you don't you don't have um you don't have the credit card fees Etc but you also can do things like um having onchain rewards so for example when people win contests um they can have a full rewards pool that is programed atically distributed to the winners all of this also not possible in web 2 you would have to have trust assumptions that the money was out there and someone was going to pay you any hackathon platform that's run in web 2 is run with these kinds of trust assumptions that someone just eventually will pay you there is no programmatic way to do it because it is not on chain um and so when you build on these Financial rails you enable all sorts of new possibilities for monetization um no Community actually could make money before web 3 uh and if you don't think that's true think of Reddit or think of Facebook groups or think of a rooms none of these had any monetary rails to to make money because they weren't built on monetary rails when you build on a blockchain you get all these advantages no okay oh was my laptop that died it's my laptop that died we'll bring it back okay so as an example of this fra ran a contest with us a couple weeks ago you can see here um they got massively botted but they set uh um they wanted to get botted they incentivized people to bought them they told every bought to to hit them up um and they got you know about three $34 per submission that these Bots were paying they ended up making somewhere close to about $1,000 um from a contest running that you cannot imagine that happening in in web 2 okay so monetary rails is is the first one second thing I want to talk about is analytics so uh I'm going to shill Bellow here um with a wonderful analytics platform and I'll give an example from um a community that built with us called rehash where rehash was running regular contests totally non-monetized just to figure out who they wanted on their podcast um and then they they took all the data because it was fully onchain they went to Bellow and Bell analyzed it and realized that 20% of users um uh from the rehash Community were zerion users and said you know if zerion is extremely popular among all your users you could probably go to them for a sponsorship so rehash went to zarion for a sponsorship xarion is now a sponsor of rehash they are making money off of this because they have the onchain analytics to go off of um when you build on chain you just unlock all of these analytics opportunities for anybody to be able to see who your customers are do customer segmentation what kind of you know uh other Protocols are they using what defi Protocols are they into what pfps do they own Etc and you can start to draw these really really incredible uh social graphs to figure out who other potential users would be what products your users are into who you should be advertising to um what products they're likely to use Etc all of this is possible just by virtue of people interacting on chain and it opens up these massive opportunities uh I would also say I think it's important um given how much you know sponsors have always financialized our data that we also start to build towards ZK opportunities here so that um we can choose to share these with our own consent um but I want to highlight that that for for creating on chain uh it's a massive unlock that you can monetize indirectly as well through the kind of analytics that you can get uh too so that would be my second second case the Third third case I want to give oh yeah and here was an example of some rewards although I don't have internet here um the third example I want to give uh is reputation um and so when when you are doing anything on chain you are developing reputation not just the action you perform but what it signifies so again if we take a contest as an example if someone votes for you in a contest that is an attestation they like your work if you have a hackathon that you run through us and vitalic is on the jury and vitalic votes for you you have this permanent onchain attestation forever that you can carry around with you that vitalic liked your work and so you think about this measurement right the communities are all measuring who is valuable to us who is who's contributing meaningfully to us in a way that we really appreciate that is a powerful reputation system you think about aird drops of the future where maybe instead of just airdropping anyone you know who created 50 Bots to use your protocol and transact and do a lot of useless swaps they started actually saying okay let's give to the people who've created useful documents for us who've helped meme us who've done marketing materials for us right who've actually given us good ideas all of that can be done in a way on chain where you're getting attestations and even getting points that would then incentivize people to do those activities in the first place too um and so here this is Andrew Hong the amazing Headmaster at Dune um who created uh a series of dashboards based off of contests that he's running for his own um data community and what's really cool about this is you know and and and the way we do it is you have first place second place third place whoever got the most points but Andrew said you know what I'm going to totally re-evaluate all of it depending on what ranking you have so the more you participate the more votes you get the higher a rank you get but the higher rank you get then that's going to weight your votes even more and I'm going to create this whole credentialing system where people are actually earning credentials over time based on how they contribute and so you can see these have different ranks that he's created um he you know they have different tokens attached to them uh Etc and you can imagine you could start making you know full NBA leagues of hackathons where people people had to have different credentials to participate at different levels you were getting higher and higher you know credentials being buil built off of it you can imagine building dating sites off of this if people tend to vote for the same thing and they have the same interest as each other then that is a powerful signal that they're they probably would get along very very well with each other too right so so all of this is possible again this is really an extension of the analytics Point um but you can build all this onchain reputation um that actually is a a powerful way to measure uh how people contri and what value they provide but then is also incentivizing them to participate in the first place and finally I'll end um with the part I'm most excited by which is what I call extensibility and what that means is you know in in web 2 Data is siloed um and so the incentive for every company building in web 2 is to Silo their data they want to be able to have that data Moe um that data Mo doesn't exist in web 3 and so this leads to a lot of concerns among VCS and investors um that there is no way to actually build a sustainable business without having a data mode and actually I would say it's a huge on unlock um it's it's a huge unlock because what you can get is these kind of Guild models where services are now modularized among a number of different services that can all interact with each other programmatically and so what I mean by that is you know any onchain action that is performed can be read by any other onchain action and then executed so again to take the example of contests if people make a decision through a contest you know who do we want to fund that person could automatically be funded who do we want to add to the multisig that person could automatically be added to the multisig you know who do we want a secretary of organization that person can automatically become Secretary of their organization all of this is possible through extensibility where you know the whatever data is being formed you know uh through one contest is then being read by another so this is hats protocol they do rule-based nfts and they actually developed a full module here so you can plug in a contest into this and then whoever wins will automatically get their nft and so we are servicing them um we're providing them with a use case right but they're also unlocking US in a really powerful way none of this could be done in web 2 this this this is this is what where it gets really exciting the any service can interact with each other and the blockchain really can be treated almost like an open API so you know going back to it monetization analytics reputation and extensibility all of these are massive unlocks and anytime I think we're looking at apps what we need to be thinking is how are they tapping into these web 3 native opportunities because once they're doing that I think and once we start seeing people doing that that's when we're going to be able to create the incentives um where users will start porting over and start using this too in a way that app Builders will want to follow and ultimately I really believe every future app will be built on chain thanks thank you David that was fantastic okay for the final uh event of our People's Choice we have um a panel that'll be moderated and attended by uh Griff green and he's going to introduce his panelists we'll give them a second to come up on stage how's everybody doing today yeah great wonderful I love to hear it hopefully you got in before the snow all right here we go another round of applause for our panel hello oh yeah test test you're rolling uh oh we're we're hot all three I love it oh boy except I'm more of a hands guy so today we are going to talk qf do people in the crowd do you know what qf stands for does anyone not know what qf stands for don't be shy really nice we got we got a couple out there that don't know what qf so qf is quadratic funding right so quadratic funding is an amazing project that has been led by gitcoin it's a idea out of uh well maybe I'll let Meg talk about that the like Origins um but first let's introduce our panels so first I'm Griff green I'm going to moderate and talk a little bit and then Meg you can introduce yourself hi I hope I'm doing my mic right um my name is Meg I'm from gitcoin I'm oh the like you're good um okay hi I'm Meg um and I'm the GMO of our Labs organization at getcoin um we uh basically have platforms for people to run grants including quadratic funding grants which we've been running ourselves for a long long time pass it over hey everybody this is Sean Anderson here known as ygg often in the crypto web 3 space so I work as a data scientist across the space I've been working with the token engineering Commons as a core contributor uh for about 3 years now I also founded a small business called longtail Financial which offers token engineering and data science Services across web 3 and the crypto economics world and I've been working on a project called tunable qf with the token engineering Commons for about the last 6 months and this is an initiative that is embedding what we call sub subject matter expertise signal into the outcome of quadratic funding so we take signals representing expertise in a domain and we embed those into the qf algorithm so basically donations are boosted when they come from a donor that has these signals and we're starting with just token Holdings uh and nft credentials so there's these nft credentials issued by the token engineering Academy and we use those as a signal uh to boost the weight of donations from donors holding those credentials so happy to be here today from like a data science token engineering perspective on the past present and future of qf nice thanks y yeah and I guess I should say I'm from gith we recently started doing qf rounds last year and they've been getting bigger and bigger and better and better and so we're having a lot of fun with it uh thanks to the infrastructure that really getcoin provided so that we could make this happen uh and but maybe we could start with a little bit of a history lesson like where did quadratic funding come from what's its story maybe Meg you can start us off there yeah of course um let me talk a little bit about what qf is um and then I'll give you a little history and context um so qf is the idea that um let's say I have a million dollars um that I want to give out to my community and instead of trusting myself to be this all knowing incredibly wise being who will perfectly allocate this millions of dollars I'm going to let my community have a say in how that money gets allocated and distributed and so quadratic funding is basically a vote with your dollars mechanism so I still get to be the millionaire in this example but my community is donating money to the projects that they want to see funded and so let's say that YG's project gets $36 donated and Griff's project gets $50 donated that means that more of my million dollars is going to go towards Griff versus YG's program um and that they're also benefiting from the crowdfunding that goes on in quadratic funding so my million dollars is now a million and a half or $2 million that's getting distributed to these communities um and you guys might be like wow that's a really great idea I wonder who came up with that and the answer is really smart people um so vitalic and a researcher named Glenn W wrote a paper on this back in 2018 I think um basically a century in crypto years um and git coin's founder read the paper and was like whoa this a really cool idea I wonder if I could build something around this um and he did and so gcoin has been running these quadratic funding Grant programs to benefit the ethereum ecosystem since 2019 at least half a century in crypto years um and we we have seen so much growth in the getcoin community in the ethereum community and also the growth in the ethereum ecosystem from the things that the community has funded through quadratic funding um and so we're so excited to see how many other people are playing in qf like gith like Tec um and really how we can continue to mature and grow this mechanism yeah and so let's start with talking about the state of qf as it is now because you know it was an idea getcoin really like led the led the charge built amazing programs uh especially on the like uh BD efforts you could say like just getting everyone in ethereum involved it really became a shelling point for ethereum projects from the 2020s to 2022 it was like if you're not on gitcoin who are you you know uh and so that was an incredible movement and then get coin's like hey the centralized stuff we're done let's let's decentralize maybe you could tell us a little more about that transition and where we went from there yeah so gcoin made a really big bet not just on qf but on the ethereum ecosystem a couple years ago we had been running these qf programs um ourselves internally for years and they' gotten really successful and we started realizing other people were coming to us and being like Hey how do I do this too and um hey I actually I don't like the rules that you guys are creating like how can I make my own system and create my own rules we were like wow this is so much bigger think getcoin just running our own programs so we kind of blew up what we had built um and created a decentralized system um and a suite of products that anybody can use to run their own qf um funding campaigns and what this has generated is so much Innovation and Community activation around qf which is so exciting to see um and we're seeing so much Innovation um in terms of the things that get funded with qf as well as in the mechanisms itself and different in more Equitable ways to distribute funding amazing amazing and then Tec came in and started running their own rounds using this software right yeah I want to really give gitcoin props cuz like they've run I think over 20 gitcoin rounds and then like Meg was saying they've now created a platform a protocol where any Community can adopt these tools and run their own programs and there's been dozens of community run um quadratic funding rounds there's been offchain rounds like I think the city of Denver was involved with running rounds um so there's been this explosion of like accessibility to these tools and the result of that also is data like we have all this data on different rounds and different networks of donations being made and different outcomes across projects and uh the the outcomes and the results of those projects so from a a data perspective that's really rich to be able to look back in time and see what has gone right what's gone wrong I um gitcoin it might have been an independent project but I think gitcoin is associated with also something called uh grants ETL which is like a standard data schema so that anyone can integrate uh quadratic funding donation data sets and outcome data sets and do analysis on that so just like major props to getcoin and that has allowed our team the coordination team at the token engineering Commons to now have run three successful Community qf rounds and right off the bat we have this kind of nature of innovation at the Tec so in our very first round uh we were looking at it and saying what can we add how can we add a Tec flavor to this and we came came up with this idea of subject matter expertise signal boosting so by having the tools open standardized and accessible you allow all these different communities to run qf rounds and also the innovation of any Community can add different pieces they can utilize different particular qf algorithms because there's there's a there's a pretty wide set of augmented algorithms that are solving different aspects of how funding is distributed I think we'll talk about that a little bit more later but yeah definitely major props to getcoin for making this accessible to teams and we've been taking full advantage of that at the Tec yeah and it's not just uh you know gitcoin has this amazing interface where you can selfs serve you can run your own round you don't need to ask anyone you can just use their use their processes that are on there but also for developers like gith we we are using the same tools we're using gitcoin passport report we're hoping to use the grants uh more more tooling uh from the grant stack as we go but we already since we've been around since uh 2017 we've collected so many uh nonprofits already on our platform we couldn't just straight transition but because of the modular modularity and the the design that gitcoin really made we were able to integrate into our current platform and we've had a lot of success with qf honestly it's been a huge uh like force for gith propagation like we've brought so many more donations so many more projects because of quadratic funding it's uh it's really an Innovative process that people love it like it really has product Market fit and uh we've seen great success where uh most of our rounds almost all of our rounds have the matching pool is about how much donations we also get so we're almost doubling the matching pool every round uh which is incredible uh in and uh the only time that wasn't true was in this most recent polygon round they they put up about $200,000 and we got around $150,000 of donations which is still pretty incredible uh for any big granter that is looking to distribute funds if you can get that kind of multiplier it really just makes sense and this is the beautiful thing I would say about qf is it just aligns incentives for the donors for the large uh the large donors and the small donors the projects this ability to ask as a project to just say can you please donate just a dollar to support us like that creates this virality for qf that is unmatched i' would say in the donation space but it's not all roses so let's let's start talking about the problems with qf in its current form uh I know I know just since I have the mic I know for me the Civil attacks are out of control recirculation attacks you know you you get a donation and then you're like well I'll just send that to my buddy and then they donate the same money over and over again there's also civil attacks uh and there's a lot of cool ways that we're mitigating this but maybe we can talk about the challenges of qf today yeah I love that we're getting into this because we were talking off stage and we're like wow one of the things that's so remarkable about being on this panel today is like we're talking about qf Innovation and we're talking about the next generation of qf it could have just been a cool experiment that people figured out how to game and so it died but as Griff said it really is so critical to these communities that we're here being like what's the next version like how do we solve all these things um and so a big Focus for us at gitcoin recently has been on um collusion resistant qf um and on basically creating a new version of the qf algorithm that looks at not just the individual donations to a project but the patterns of individual donations to a project uh um and solving for basically collusion resistance um waiting down the projects that may have just gotten a lot of $1 donations from a very new wallet address um and waiting up towards patterns of unique donations across multiple projects um and we've seen huge improvements in our ability to um basically protect against uh those kind of civil attacks and uh collusion attempts while at the same time those people who are Cil attacking are still donating to public goods so kind of a win-win yeah this is an interesting topic um I've been on the back end of three Community qf rounds now and so we see cibil attacks we see collusion it's there in every round what's really interesting is you can see it it's really obvious um what we like to do is render the donation data set as a network so you have this like bipartite graph of projects being funded and then donors making donations and a donation is an edge and so you can see in the network there's you'll have a project that just has like 40 donors that only donated to that project and they donated like exactly a dollar um there was one siil attack we saw that completely failed because we had a threshold of $1 donations in order to be matched and because the price of eth had like changed that day someone did this Cil attack of like 200 donations but all their donations were under a dollar so none of them got matched anyways so it's it's really interesting to be behind the scenes and because all of this is on chain anyone can analyze this data like you can see the addresses that are that are doing these attacks and there's there's ways of addressing it there's third party Services we've identified that will come in and do like data analysis on your donation set and identify um the Civil res civil attacks uh gitcoin the gitcoin data science team is good they provide I think what they call squelching so I don't know exactly how it works behind the scenes but they like give you a score for every donation uh based on their analysis and you know how likely that is to be part of a Cil attack and then you can just set a custom threshold for for what donations you want to get squelched so um it's kind of like this game of whack-a-mole people are consistently trying to figure out how to game the system and then people behind the scenes running these rounds are consistently figuring out how to um defend against those attacks so it's so it's actually really fun to be a part of it at these early stages and like Meg was saying like this could have been an experiment that just died cuz like oh people are gaming it it doesn't work but to see this like Squad of superheroes assemble and say no this is critical for the for the future of funding public goods and decision- making in general we're going to get it right we're going to make it work and there's all this Innovation around uh having that be the case like uh there's different mechanisms you can apply to the qf outcomes uh Meg talked about that a little bit there's something called um like cluster matching so you can really tune down anyone who is uh making the same decisions if if you have two people who are donating to all the same grants you can almost think of them as the same person and so those um those those boosts th the matching funds going to those donations naturally get tuned down so there's there's cool ways to do that do it in the math of the mechanisms themselves but then also just on the operational side on the data analysis of of like the network graph of donations so uh yeah just so much Innovation happening in that like cat and mouse game yeah one of the biggest challenges is this uh you know you know getcoin passport is amazing it's a it's such a valuable tool to make sure that people are unique but then it for people who are maybe not as onchain uh you know Savvy and don't have the history then it kind of blocks them as well even though they're real people who want to donate and so there's that like you know this C and mouse game between people running the rounds and the Cil attackers has some casualties of like like the the user experience for normal people that are just trying to donate to public goods so it's uh it's really interesting and how how we mitigate that uh one thing that I I see coming up maybe now we can transition to the the future of qf because that's the juicy stuff right uh I see a lot of benefit in offchain qf I mean if you're using credit cards man civils get a lot easier to detect right I don't make I know that there is a gitcoin project that is uh maybe it's gitcoin maybe it's spun out I don't know but it's definitely uh something started by gitcoin that's doing just normal qf for normal people with credit cards right yeah so this is kind of a side project um that Kevin auke has qf for normal people if you will um that is just all credit card based using the mechanism outside of a crypto context um which is amazing I mean we sometimes forget when we're at conferences like this how much of a bubble we live in um and because we've been able to experiment with qf in this bubble we're also seeing the potential it has outside of this bubble um which I'm so excited for this kind of simple qf like offchain qf and the stuff that gith is doing um with accepting credit card donations um big feature asket getcoin too and something that we're considering for the future um but one of there's a couple different vectors that I see for like the future of qf um offchain and real rwas for qf if you will um and as well as just um novel matching mechanisms as well as novel funding distributions through qf talk about them talk about them all right all right um well you talked about the real world stuff um and we talked a little bit about the mechanism stuff too so the other one is distribution um and so right now uh we're just like hey you make a donation great it goes straight to the recipient wallet um and and if when the matching pool comes out it's all given like lumpsum UPF front um there's a couple of like things that crypto has already gotten right really well in the payment space that could easily be applied to qf um one of them is streaming and so we just did a really cool integration with super fluid who's a streaming provider and so now we can do streaming qf um which has all kinds of implications around um having always on streams of funding and always on qf rounds rather than having to capture like a moment in time where you harness everyone's donations and hopefully they all happen to be online that week um the other one which I'd be really excited to see built in the space um is Milestone based qf and again so using that kind of always on streaming version but tying it to impact Milestones as we tie grants more and more towards impact and um and and getting the work done yeah I'll add to some of what Meg said I think seeing qf rolled out in offchain instances is going to be really big and could be very impactful like in real world assets activism and just the general space of public goods like non-digital public goods cuz digital public goods get a ton of attention is kind of the primary application of these tools in in this space but can we can we look at like uh Forest conservation and and environmentalism and um even just just general governance like resource allocation how are resources being allocated and can we use quadratic funding and quadratic voting to aggregate signals across people and something that qf really excels at is finding alignment between groups of people who normally disagree it you can do this thing it's like consilience optimization and so the projects that are approved by the most diverse groups get the most funding so it's a way of like aggregating people's opinions in this hyper fragmented world and I think there's such an impactful aspect to that far beyond the space of just digital public goods yeah I was joking around with one of the people on gitcoin data science team yesterday and we were like the only people who are doing more social engineering thinking than us on qf is Facebook and we're doing it for good we swear I'm curious uh behind the scenes of getcoin I cluster matching is like really cool are there other alos in the mix that you guys are considering I mean you know cluster matching is cool because of course if you want to attack it you just have to donate to other projects right uh so that's kind of cool but I'm sure that you know the research is your researchers are always going what's uh what's in the next like yeah yeah um we have partnered with some PhD researchers from like the real world outside of crypto um and the stuff that they've been cooking up is really fun um what you probably don't realize to if you're not a super data Nerd Like Us on the stage um is that Under the Umbrella of cluster matching we've actually gone through probably four major iterations of the cluster matching algorithm um and so we've settled on one after a ton of experimentation um that we are going to roll out for our upcoming gg20 round um and use in production make available to all of our customers too um after that we're still figuring out kind of what is the next Frontier for our next um like experimentation on the mechanism um and would love to hear from anyone in the gitcoin community or anybody who's been experimenting with this if there's things you're passionate about um oh I completely lost my train of thought oh the other thing I was going to say uh y has talked a little bit about this but because all of the data is on chain and public and because our product is open source we have a library that anyone can contribute in new qf algorithm too um and use that to run their own rounds if you want to go see the source of some of these mechanisms that Meg's uh alluding to you can look at a paper um Glenn W is one of the researchers on this it's called Beyond collusion resistance um something something pluralistic funding and it just outlines all it's got like six different mechanisms for qf and just evaluates all of them and if you get to the back of that paper there's a really cool one that that hasn't gotten a lot of attention yet it's called I think it's called igen matching something like that so it it really leans heavy on this idea of utilizing the structure of a social network of or a social graph to embed information into the outcome of quadratic funding so you have like a a network of all the the people and the projects in your ecosystem and then you like factor that Network to understand the similarities between uh people and projects and then it directly optimizes this like consilience like agreement between diverse groups so and in that paper you'll find there's so many notes where they're like this mechanism seems so promising but we there's too much to research here like calling on future researchers to take a look at this mechanism this mechanism so I think we're just like scratching the surface of the Innovation that that can be Unleashed by exploring these algorithms deeper yeah one one of the next things about qf is applying it outside of donations I'm really excited and this is something gith has been actively researching for years years and uh and really it's it's coming to a head for us uh it's not it's not done or ready or anything like that but we have some some big ideas about combining bonding curves with quadratic funding and uh a y was actually independently saying this before the panel like yeah what if we can add bonding curves to this because we're a bunch of bonding curve Maxis uh just just uh bonding bonding curves are like a token economy that is a bonding curve like creates liquidity automates liquidity into the token creation itself so you can't just issue a token uh like print a bunch of tokens without putting collateral behind each token that is issued so uh I think this will win a Nobel prize in economics eventally I've said this many times because uh it's the first example of a single-sided market uh that the public can access so imagine if you want to buy Amazon stock someone has to sell you Amazon stock if you want to sell a mattress someone's got to buy your mattress but with a bonding curve if your mattress is only on a bonding curve you know then uh then you could actually if you wanted to sell your mattress you could just burn the mattress in the bonding curve don't burn mattresses it's not good for the environment but you could burn the mattress in the bonding curve and get release collateral that was put there when the mattress was created right uh and of course that's a lot easier to do with tokens than real world assets but uh I think it's going to be a huge innovation for micro economies and one thing that I've noticed from like there's so many side benefits from what gitcoin has done with quadratic funding and one of them is this regular Cadence this like every three months there is this like checkin with projects that you utilize quadratic funding and imagine if there were microeconomist that were every three months being checked in on and you could do a bulk buy into that bonding curve as the donors to actually with a matching pool that would kind of incentivize donors to also participate and uh and then you get these check-ins on these micro economies and they have this regular like investment opportunity you could say and just imagine how much easier it would be for a small economy to say just invest $1 into my project you know just invest one just donate $ one do has been such a powerful pitch if we can make it just invest $1 wow that would be next level and we could actually start building uh what I think is the future of crypto and and how we eventually like build something better than governments we could actually start building free markets around public goods uh so that's like that's one that's like where I see qf plus bonding curves coming in strong but I'm sure there's also lots of other cool things in the mix yeah I always I'm like the new girl at gitcoin and also getcoin has been around forever in qf so I always love to like interview people and be like hey ytg so if you were setting up a d right now you're going to issue a token you're going to start like a qf focus program or grants program what would you do like how would you implement bonding curves or how would you start like knowing that there's this whole Frontier that's now available I love that yeah so I would I would point to this concept that you know a lot of people see qf kind of in a vacuum they're like oh qf is so cool like let's do that but in reality qf is embedded in a much larger ecosystem the whole world of like tokenized ecosystems blockchain everything that's on chain defi nfts gaming like qf is naturally interoperable with all of that because you're working on chain and so that's something to just keep in mind when thinking about qf how can it be like stitched together with everything we've seen coming out of Defi and tokenization and so what what I would be interested in is pretty much what what Griff was saying is like if every project is its own micro economy so you've got an idea for a public goods project and you want to raise donations through gitcoin I what I would like to see is just this standard way that becomes adopted to just switch on a bonding curve and say okay now our project is actually a little micro economy that anyone can invest in and when we receive funding through quadratic funding it goes directly into collateral in our economy and then generates tokens that we can use for local trade people can invest in people can speculate in this project so this like acceleration of microeconomist using bonding curves and and there's no limit there like whatever you can do with tokens whatever you can do with smart contracts you can stitch that around the quadratic funding ecosystem uh like at Tec we're doing that we're using um there's for those of you who don't know there's the token engineering Academy which is this really cool like decentralized academic institution that brings together researchers and teachers and students uh to provide educational content in the domain of token engineering and they've produced basically an undergraduate level course called the foundations of token engineering or token engineering fundamentals actually and as you progress through that course you receive nft credentials that indicate your your performance in the course and your completion of the courses and we're using those nfts uh to to boost donors if someone comes in and has these nft credentials they get a boost on their donation as an indication of subject matter expertise so all these different ways that you can stitch together pieces components it's like Legos right governance Legos public goods funding Legos yeah I really love like civil attacks are one thing what about expertise you know how do we how do we give expertise extra points we're always talking in qf about how do we dock points from potential sibles uh there's the other side of the coin too and I love that about the TC I haven't I haven't seen any other projects do that use tunable qf have you uh no it's like pretty early there's I've seen conversations of people hinting at this and there's been some interest we've got interest from polygon and we've been having discussions with gith as well as rolling this out but I think there's so much potential and just from like a general research perspective of understanding the qf environment as a network structure uh that's that's something I'm really interested in and what we're looking at uh at the T you you can see like the kind of the flows and the clusters of experts like if you identify okay these 10 people are these 10 people are experts in the field and they all donated to like these three grants you can just see that in the donation data set so um yeah I think there's we're excited to have more communities adopt our tqf we do have a open- source tooling available it's like github.com commmons bu/ tqf uh there's documentation on how to roll out tunable quadratic funding and it's very modular there's like five different components in there um mostly around like using token distributions as signals from the sort of proxy signals for expertise so anyone can take a look at that and we're excited to start working with other communities to roll that out it's a beautiful dashboard honestly and and I GI did use a version of tunable qf in conjunction with polygon but it didn't really um boost instead of boosting expertise we actually boosted a specific subset of projects so they had a joke race but the joke race wasn't extremely successful they didn't have a lot of Engagement and so there's they're originally saying hey the top 100 projects of these 300 projects will make it to qf but then because the joke race didn't get enough engagement uh they didn't feel that the results really fit the bill so what they did instead we kind of forked table qf and we gave the top 100 projects in joke race a bump so that every donation counted as two like counted uh counted as double so if you donate $10 it counts as a $20 donation and then those projects will naturally get more but they won't uh but the other 200 projects could still participate oh that's so interesting one of the things that always comes up for me too when we talk about expertise um is like impact and reputation too um which is almost like the automation of expertise in a way so um there's a whole like social network graph of expertise and how do we point to that person there who we know is really smart and knows a lot about this thing and wait Their donation and also are there kind of provable onchain ways to do that um either on the donor or the project side um so another just like really interesting area of exploration yeah I would love to see that I would love to be like hey you know okay these are the known civil addresses we dock them but these are the known leaders in the space these are the known like expertise in a subject matter these are the known xyz's let's give them a bump you know uh I is there any work going on in that so I pitched a really crazy idea to the team and got shut down for a very good reason which is why you work with people who are smarter than you um but for our um gg20 around we have a great um integration with Karma which is a uh kind of like impact attestation platform and we were thinking ooh everyone who at least attests their impact we could give them a bump in their matching funding through some version of you know tunable or other qf um it felt like a little too novel to introduce during a big funding round but if anybody's interested um let me know yeah I'll say that's the direction we're looking at at the Tec um is utilizing the ethereum attestation Services uh protocol which is just this very general way of identifying schemas for data and attestations and putting that on chain so um like we started with token distributions as a proxy signal for expertise but I think moving towards the attestation layer is is the next step of that you can get very granular like you described The Social Network of reput and expertise I think pairing that with qf is is going to be the future and it's going to like totally change the game something that makes me so excited about that too like combining this with qf is people really care when money is involved um and so when you match these two things together you're like cool experimental system plus money like shit's getting real yeah that that's one of the things for I think for bootstrapping reputation in the space in general is attaching reputation to real utility where money is in involved where maybe your reputation doesn't have transferable liquid value but you can say look this reputation does have monetary value uh because it's connected to either a token you can buy or action you can take that distributes capital in one way or another uh I I would also you know there do you guys see big green Dow uh it was like uh Kimble musk is Elon musk's brother had a it was like a food Justice Dow uh in in the states that was trying to like you know solve some problems for whatever but the interesting was thing was their mechanism where to have voting power in the Dow you had to be a project in the Dow and and I would be interested to also see like you know there's there's a complication in that you don't want projects necessarily donating the funds that was donated to them to other projects so that's that's a challenge with this idea but I'd also love to see what projects think you know and let because if you're a builder in the space and you're using using other people's software and and then you donate a dollar of the funds that effectively you're getting you know that's a that's a pretty big signal yeah I love that you know conflicts of interest are only a thing like you get to decide what your conflicts of interest are and that could work very well for different programs and again like you work with onchain data you just run the simulations and see what comes out in the wash um the other thing that I love too is on the Retro our pgf space we see so many people who have gotten dispersements from Big programs like optimism R pgf and are then raising their own hands to say hey I'm going to run my own grants program qf or retr pgf to pass it along in my community yeah I I'd like to see a future um where more public goods funding mechanisms are wired together all through streams so instead of having like three qf rounds a year you just have this continuous allocation you're like I'm going to subscribe to these 10 projects and I'm going to donate $500 a month and you just get this realtime network of flow through between individuals and projects and matching funds and you can watch in real time how much fund where all the funding is going and who's re routing it where yeah I think this is one of the challenges between like the mechanism design and the the user experience right how do we get the cool mechanisms but then make them easy to use so it says our time is up but I think we have extra time right five minutes great uh so uh you know this balance of user experience plus like awesome mechanisms has been like a really CH like for gith we we really try to keep things simple uh and and focus on user experience and then wait wait for you guys to like you know battle test the awesome stuff and see how we can make it simple for regular nonprofits to use and not just blockchain nerds but I don't know I feel like Meg you might have some thoughts on this like how do you balance the user experience needs plus the cool mechanisms um this is where I live um and it's so hard um especially in a crypto context we um we're not set up for success with the infrastructure that's available to app developers right now um just from a ux perspective and then also when you're trying to do really novel things um with what goes on behind the scenes um so it's incredibly challenging given that we have a crypto audience I always default towards giving people more information um and optionality wherever we can um and we have to marry this too with the people who are just like I I get qf I want to come in I want to doll donate a dollar to these five projects don't make it hard for me um and I think too just like knowing your community and really like exactly how gith has done like tailoring your ux to your community is so important yeah I would I would just speak a little bit to this point that uh qf is a bit of a killer app for for crypto for blockchain I think it's one of the largest drivers of adoption actually in the last few years because how many people get a call from their friend and say hey I've got this proposal on gitcoin I'm trying to get funding uh like Griff has been really pointing out like can you just donate $1 like one $1 could make a huge difference for funding and I think there's been thousands tens of thousands of people onboarded into crypto maybe maybe hundreds of thousands of people I don't know but a lot of people onboarded into crypto through the the qf ecosystem the gitcoin ecosystem and I think that's a really important point to people for people uh to consider and uh the other thing I would say is like also props to qf getcoin and the whole ecosystem for like really creating a cultural movement um people are thinking about this concept of public goods more than ever like shout out to auke like he he really puts out a lot of media and content and attention into this domain and I think the cultural value of that is so huge and and shouldn't be discounted relative to just like the technology and the algorithms and the funding outcomes uh we're seeing like a huge shift in in paradigms where people are thinking oh yeah you can make a living working in public goods you can get funded working in public goods like and and pairing that with what we're seeing now with retro pgf we're getting these like interoperable uh complimentary mechanisms that open up avenues for people to like devote their time and their energy to the public good space and and that's huge I I want to double down on the onboarding thing because I wonder I I'm my fiance was on on boarded to crypto via qf a friend of mine was like hey you should you know donate a dollar to giveth and I wonder if I would be married to her without quadratic funding in getcoin she made these P you truly funding what matters yeah exactly that's so amazing and that's like one of the things that just makes work meaningful I think for everyone in the space is like you follow this chain of okay we're working crypto and you know crypto is great for a lot of things but it like really um allows us to experiment in bear and transparent ways to run experiments that make things like qf possible and then qf unlocks this ability to really fund what matters and discover that like public goods really matter to people and you can build up a sustainable funding mechanism and sustainable economies around them and then look what comes at the end of that people forget that if we want to build something better than governments we need to fix the public goods problem and that's uh that's that's what excites me about qf that's what excites me about everything in this space is that we can build something better than governments and I know qf is going to be a part of it and so thank you guys for telling us about the future of qf and uh thank you to eth Denver and everyone who voted in joke race to make this panel a reality thank you guys thanks all thank you excellently timed thank you guys this was fantastic all right that wraps that wraps up our 2hour segment on the E Denver People's Choice thank you guys so much for coming