ETHTaipei 2024 Workshop：TOBI_Part 2

all building devs building your own products your not really really really but we're all building one three products though right this should be relevant I was going to drop all the participants at this panel uh a little bit of e so this is just going to make it cheaper for me I'm not going to have to drop as let's give them I think Martin was just chatting some people so give them it's already 10 P I think it should be okay you know what I'm going to get started and then we'll just get started and we'll see how how things kind of go as they go so uh yeah so then hey just int self introduction I'm Chris uh found founder and CEO of Toby wallet uh we just started this about 6 months ago so Prett early on um uh we raised our you know preed end of last year and we're we're going out there now you know to raise our seed ground um you know we've uh sort of been been we're in our pre-launch right now and we're trying to get folks um you know uh ready for our Early Access but uh yeah today all I wanted to kind of do is talk about sort of how we can boost web3 adoption as a whole and hopefully it's kind of useful for everyone so um basically the agenda this can be short now obviously but like we're just going to do a quick intro going to talk about a little bit about it's not okay so intro for about a minute and then I'll do uh theoretical Frameworks just talk a little bit about how to think about tech adop sort of the right way so it's easy to kind of uh think about what to do then I'm going to apply the example to web 3 I'm going to apply the example to our product in particular and then give everyone a chance to sort of try applying the framework to your own product and then kind of discuss it and just answer any question want um and so introduction so yeah as I mentioned that's me I'm kind of a web 3 Maxi nft guy uh also do you know just love film uh founded Toby wall previously did a bunch of stuff uh another web three project called fam uh like py penguins Doodles all those kind of folks uh Google motion blah BL blah so you know I'm kind of an nft guy that's me also me this is also me this is also me I'm sure a lot of you guys are also s kind of things we got a lot of different identities and a lot of different communities uh so let's talk a little bit about sort of the theoretical Frameworks here uh so I think the oh yeah that's true hey maybe this is a little bit better Okay cool so okay so who here is a build let's let's sort of say who's a developer more specific developers okay who is on the product or go to market things okay also a little bit okay good so we got a lot of General here that's that's good St okay and this should be reasonbly uh how many of you guys have heard of the diffusion of Innovations framework with this quote it's an old book not expecting anyone to really heard of it so uh there's this guy E M Rogers diffusion of innovation was written in 1962 um actually this is the book that ended up giving us a lot of popular terms okay so that how many of you have heard of early adopters right I mean kind of no not really not not in use anymore o doctors uh crossing the chasm you guys know that one you guys heard that one uh critical mass you know that one was a little bit more to kind of popularized right so it gave us a lot of innovation adoption Frameworks to help think about how Innovations diffuse in society uh and as a result we' got a lot of these terms that people have been built on over time in academic literature and other books in order to explain how things get deved right so the good thing is we can then use that to sort of analyze how that how it's going to affect cl3 so he starts off at sort of a very macro right and it's like you've got five systematic systemic adoption facts if you got a new innovation then it's going to be dependent on time it's kind of a silly one but it's fine 60s social systems so like you know what other what are the government incentives in place you know like what is the stage of media all these other things communcation channels like how are you going to communicate about the Innovation to other people uh and then adopt right so over time U I think the only two that sort of remain relevant these days you know about like 60 years later is really sort of what he says about adopters how we think about who they are and The Innovation itself right the good thing is that that's very that Maps very well to us as Builders because that means the Innovation is kind of what you control right you control what you do with your Innovation what features you build how you build it and then the adopters you don't control over that market right so ultimately this map well if you think about it just like this subset it Maps very well to other Concepts like product Market fit which I'm sure we all kind know right so this is really your product and then this is kind of the market right so how what how can you think about that so this is the adoption curve that he you know put forward and popularized and this has become a very a pretty well-known framework right so you kind of divide up all the possible users uh that you might be targeting right into five general buckets the first you know innovators that's kind of really you guys right we are the ones who are actually building the solutions interested in the technology doing the research thinking about how these things could be done better trial and error Etc right then we release it and we release it to this very important SE segment of people called early adopter right and this applies to whoever your target you know uh a user is right this could be application devs if you're an infrastructure provider or if you're an application developer this could be end users right but you need somebody to be an early adopter you need to be able to find people who are willing to take that risk to try your product before it's fully matur and so that term early adopters has become you know quite popular to talk about when when you're thinking about going from 0 to one for a startup or for a product right how do you get these early adopters how do you identify them then you move on to things like early majority late majority Etc and because the difference between early adopters and those majority people is so big in in in practice that there was a concept called the CM right so there's a CM between early adopters and majority people the early market and the mainstream market and there have been books written in particularly was a very famous one called Crossing that talks about what can you do uh as a Founder as a marketer to help a product cross that Casas what you need to do right and again that concept has subsequently now mapped very well to things like prop Market fit right you can kind of only really think about Crossing aasm uh if you already have some sort of product Market fit otherwise you're just going to be wasting money you might cross over but then it's just not going to retain and you're going to users anyway so these Frameworks actually you know over the past 60 years you know people have found a lot of very similar things but actually it kind of all comes back to a lot of the things that were um you know performed in this diffusion of Innovations uh book in theory okay so uh another curve another graph that you might end up being familiar with as a result of this is this kind of s-shaped adoption curve right so as a result of that if you think about the cumulative um adoption based on the the the distribution of the users below right you the cumulative and it ends up this kind of like eser with some very critical junctures that show you hey you know you hit prod Market fit or that you're really starting to take off because you see that uh the knee of the curve as they call it right the the adoption rate kind of goes exponentially a little bit and then it kind of sustains and so this is the kind of thing where you know again these are just these are great ways to think about you know there tools that end up you helping explain but also if you're actually a builder it helps you think about where am I am I hitting this part of the curve am I here am I here you know and then that should that would affect the strategy that we need to use in order to get to the next stage so other than the adopter Cur which is sort of all that previous he also um you know he also sort of pioneered this kind of adoption decision process it's now looking back it's pretty simple right I mean it's like okay knowledge you know back then I think mass media was sort of more a thing so you you have to know about an innovation before you can consider you know whether or not they want to adopt it then there sort of persuasion and key opinion leader change agents you know all these kinds of folks are like you know trying to influence you you've got decision making so once you've kind of been exposed to it enough you think about am I going to adopt it or am I going to reject it uh and then implementation confirmation Etc right and again this applies to everything from businesses adopting the cloud to should I use Tik Tok right I me these are all similar kinds of decision processes uh but you know just kind of into framewor to think about that this is just something help to know I don't think it's you know necessarily to people uh specifically marketing and then the last one uh that you talks about in a little bit of depth that I think is quite relevant still is something called Innovation factors so these are the factors that relate to the Innovation itself that will help you make it easier to adopt and this is actually quite a nice framewor and that's the one we're going to work about today right so he he explains five factors which we go in depth in in in a second but the relative advantage of your Innovation or if you want to think about it more uh you know concretely or relevant to you yourself it's sort of the relative advantage of your product relative to other products relative to your previous product if you're doing neration relative to a previous type of Technology right so relative Advantage compatibility with the existing things out there both the existing tools as well as Society you know our Behavior complexity trialability just means how easy is it for a new user to try your Innovation your product uh what is the cost to them you know is the cost of failure if they try and try and it Etc and observability so when they try it um do other people know right if they're using it is it easy for other people to see that they're using it therefore you can have this effect of being able to tell about each right this is a great framework I we're going to come back with this in just one second uh so and then the second framework I wanted to talk about is from a separate you know research agency called Gartner I mean have you guys you guys have heard of this one gter hype cycle this one's you know also very very popular um and so this this is originally from a research gr that they actually kind of like branded and put out there that ended up being pretty good uh you know the original paper was written in 1995 they've done subsequent sort of updates uh throughout the years um but it really kind of like talks about like how you know there's an animation trigger people expectations and the cool thing about this kind of thing now is that this really starts mapping to like you know we can all imagine how this maps to web 3 as a or like Bitcoin or like a the right and like how you know it kind of spikes and it comes down uh and we'll see that uh you know in play a lot in s as well and so you know I think this was actually in one of their own paps but I don't see this one as often but I think it's actually quite instructive like you think about when does the peak Peak like when does it turn it's because a lot of people stop joining in just because it's it right like this curve this positive height curve is driven by a lot of people who may not even know that much about product of the under underlying Innovation themselves but they just need to be in because other people are in right but at some point and without you know really going into too much detail about why it stops but at some point people the number of people doing that just stops and slows down enough that ultimately it becomes a drop off right but then on the other side you get the opposite effect right and you don't want to miss out just because it's out right so it's kind of I mean this SL just fomo at work fundamentally right fomo on both sides or you know fear and greed whatever but um again it's just going useful framework and since you know you guys are pry familiar with it so actually you know they related the two again you kind of like you know plot one on top of the other for all purposes you get a similar type of thing right so you get this Innovative um you know technology trigger you got a be plated expectations as a lot of adopters start talking about it and showing it off and people realize that there's something there but then there's solusion actually the features are not all good enough yet there actually the technology is not mature enough yet it's not actually that useful yet but everyone had to try it just because all these early adopters these key influencers you know everybody was talking about right so you have that promo effect but then as you as the product itself begins to mature then you start moving back up that Sil of Enlightenment and eventually up with with good adoption right and then the last one so you know I did white back 2011 uh long time ago but this was something that you know was talked about quite often at that time from an essay 2008 how many of you have seen this one right I mean this is a very classic kind of startup curve uh and you know there's some great memes that came out of this you know it's like Tech brunch initiation at the time when Tech brunch was pretty much the go-to publication right you get launched on Tech brunch all of a sudden you know your servers explode everybody's like you know pinging you about you know like wow congratulations you guys on tick crunch and then the next day nobody's talking about you because there a new prodct right and that's a real phenomenon right that that actually happens it happened to us it's happened to every single startup during that time you get this amazing like initiation and then and then goes nowh then the trough of Sorrow is something that everybody loves talking about it's basically 95% of your startup journey is spent in the Tropic Sor so it's kind of like kind of get used to it and then you just like you know just learn to live with it and what does that feel like and then including things like RS a false hope because like you think it's getting better but it's really not uh and then hopefully you get right but this is a great another just another good framework to think about adoption and you know why why why do I talk about three different very similar uh adoption Frameworks is actually because what you'll realize is that there's very similar adoption patterns at different levels of social skill right whether you're talking about a very macro level and like it's the entire h of society adopting whatever computers or something like that or you go all the way down to micro of like your next product release you can think about it the exact same way right there's going to be this type of a a hyp cycle is type of a curve this kind of like expectations that are coming down and then slow adoption you know all those kinds of things thinking about early adopters all of that is is relevant no matter what level of scale you're talking about you could be a huge company you could be a country even you could be you know a single product manager single developer pushing out aties right and uh it's it's fa right also you know what that means is that industry category product you think about web 3 and you've got like product category like wallets and then it could be like Toby wallet you know our product specifically right so it's the same kind of a mapping and then it's also very interesting to sort of think about it as it's very similar even at different time scales right if you look at the price of Bitcoin all time up until you still called like a few months ago right it's looks remarkably similar to like it did from the period in like 2014 to 2016 and it looks again remarkably similar to a random week that I pulled out in Bitcoin CH you know two months ago right this kind of um idea had is that you can kind of use that anytime you want the result is that history ends up repeating itself this is ai ai in the in in the 80s with expert systems or deep learning in the you know like the knots and and the teens 2000s and then recently J same kind of thing it's it's going to repeat itself over and over and what it also means that history copies itself it means that not only within a single industry but you're going to see the same thing happening uh with web 3 that you did with Cloud as you did with v as you did with AI right and if anything web 3 is actually the most recent call is uh if you kind of actually think about AI is actually been around much longer than web 3 so you know then we get we're going to get next into like where are we you know web 3 on this adoption curve but uh you know I would I would way earlier on on web 3 than you know folks are in AI so yeah that's I mean if you guys are familiar I mean these it's like fractal everywhere right I mean you know yeah so applying examples all right let's move into some kind of meaty stuff here so the question you know that we just POS is sort of like where is web3 cu that helps you like I said sort of think about what kind of strategies that you want to kind of kind of employ um you know I would argue that there's a little bit of difference I think web 3 uh does two things really well and I'll talk about that in a second when it gets a relative um uh relative Advantage but it's actually infrastructure and it's also uh digital assets right so web 3 as a digital asset I would say that we're actually starting to move into the early majority in this point I think one of the things and we'll talk about a second like web 3 has been very good at to help adoption is because digital assets in web 3 land fit very very well they're very compatible with digital Assets in traditional and we'll talk about that in a second Bitcoin I mean Bitcoin getting an ETF is a is a is definitively a majority that's not like that's not about right I mean the ability to buy a Bitcoin ETF is definitively in ear majority right on the other hand using web 3 to um create you know a social f app that's way Weir like you know we're still I think we've only had one H cycle maybe and like a small like maybe Trend Tech has gotten this maybe a little bit of a tiny bump right but like we're still sort of in the innovator the leader a stage for something like special F and you can talk about the same thing for like defi game five you know all these kinds of different waves you kind of break it down but so you know web 3 is not monolithic either but some parts of it are moving the majority at this point very rapidly and some parts are still early in the why is that right so let's take a look right so okay here's the FR and this is what we're going to work through in a second as well if you guys are interested right relative P it answers this question in what way is web 3 better mouse trap you guys kind of heard heard that sorry like what kind of features and performance do you get out of web 3 that you don't from it's comparative you know it's it's alternative web 2 then you have the P how well does web 3 fit with existing values patterns of behavior tools right so that's not just in tools even though it's mentioned but also Society like are the habits that you're going to be uh bringing to the table when you interact with things in web 3 similar to the habits that you had when you were interacting with things in web 2 right complexity how easy is it to learn to use web 3 trialability how low is the cost of trying web 3 and observability are web three benefits noticeable someone's using web three can others see it being used all right so I'm going to give you kind of you know this is just my quote unquote answers to these questions um but uh relative Advantage I I personally think compared to web 2 uh there's again two things right so there's infra and there's digal and then assets and then you compare it to web 2 and you compare it to digital assets advantages are are clear right so you've got some permissable stuff um got composable stuff you got digital permanence you've got digital ownership uh and it really brings out cost of creating digital assets these are like fundamental comparative advantages of web 3 versus web 2 that's actually if you think about the whole Drive of the innovation of web 3 it's these kinds of principles that are pushing everything else right why is a social High app going to be better than a social why is a game3 going to be better than a game in web 2 why is a digital asset or a financial asset in web 3 going to be better than a financial asset in web 2 it's because of these underlying structural properties of web 3 that make it different from web 2 right but it also comes with structural disadvantages right so as we know the cost of interaction with storage is much much higher as well as the lack of flexibility in terms of upating and scal right so these things you know it's a f bargain right it's like it's it's it's a tradeoff that that we made and said okay well in exchange for all of those things uh you know we're we were willing to take some of these disadvantages and we'll talk about what the concrete impact say so compatibility though I think it's very I think it's very interesting this this Bates very very starkly between infrastructure and the assets that are created on top of that infrastructure the infrastructure itself I would argue that compatibility is incredible L like it's you think about how easy is it right to switch from Web Two stack to a web 3 stack in terms of like going all the way down to like your servers and like your data storage it's incredibly right it's not only just difficult for like a technology perspective but also the tradeoffs that you have to currently make from things like privacy and control perspective is are almost I mean it's it's you know breaking we three in a lot of places right it's like without solving things like privacy for example we're never actually going to move Beyond uh we're never going to overtake web 2 as an infrastructure provider for the interet and I think that's something you know I mean talked about it as well this is just something that's very core and and a deep Challenge and on top of that it's incredibly complex St so in order to adopt web3 as an individual every single one of us had to go through a crazy Journey of understanding how blockchains work to some extent but definitely how C phrases work how signatures work how Gas Works how chains work like all of that is knowledge that sure we now have and we can do it and we feel like experts but like imagine every single new person trying to do that every single person in this room is clearly still an innovator or an early adopter right except when you think about the currency side right when you think of the currency side the compatibility and complexity is so clear right compatibility wise you can trade a mean coin the same way that you trade a stock no difference right cuz the things you talk about are who's going to buy off me are these prices going up or down the number of things you have to think about are exactly the same right so when you think about you know now with BT you know like BTC ETFs you know taking off lowering the complexity for people to get involved with that that adoption is going to be huge right because now you don't have to even like get a Bitcoin wallet you know you know hopefully if ETFs up coming through doesn't you know crush us you know that uh you know that's going to that's going to help with ETL right so that kind of stuff is like it's such a different world for infrastructure compatibility want me is so terrible right now with at least asset so on the financial asset side of things it's getting much right and a lot of that is really because it's so compatible with the existing Financial system right you can wrap it into an ETF how would you do that by nft just doesn't like who's going to make an ETF out of I don't knowes or like putting that it's just not it's not there trialability and observability trialability uh has been also just terrible in3 right so this is also like if you're looking for problems to solve in 53 like there's a Litany of problems to solve right trility is so bad mistakes are often permanent they're costly it's a huge and steep learning curve the moment that you get scammed you lose everything right you make a bad transaction and you buy something they're stuck right you deploy contract and it was incorrect it's getting haed you know like there's all these things where like trialability of web 3 is extremely costly right it's it's making mistakes in web 3 is very costly because of the cost related to actually doing things and then also the fact that it touches money and so as a result uh and it's also of complex and it's open and it's there's just all these Circ things that make trialability very very very very very B right and this can be a observability also I think here is that for INF forend tools fundamentally observability is very different right it's like how do I know that I use an AWS versus Google Google you know Google Cloud for example right like that's not even something that's easy on what two SES is now you're trying to tell people it's like oh yeah it's like at some point I'm going to advertise that I'm using world three infrastructure instead of world two infrastructure that's that's quite tough again at least on the currency and asset side it's somewhat more observable because you're going to flex you're going to flex about money that you made maybe you're rocking an nft instead of you know like PSP on on Twitter something like that a little bit more on the asset side but the infer side how could we kind of improve that so that's where that you fli it right so then you go okay from the strategy side you assess it and you look at what the current situation is then it becomes solution how might we increase web3 option so if you guys are sort of prod people or designers maybe the framework of like how might we be familiar with like hmws right to to flip a problem on its head you just go okay well how might there and so how might we increase web 3's relative bage how might we make web3 more compa how might we make it easier to learn how might we lower the cost of trying it how might we make web 3 benefits more no these are all things that will help web 3 uh you know get a better option this is just again just a super short list that I put together of like some things that I've seen some ideas Etc right so obviously we all know trying to scale lochain infrastructure right we do know this including on and BTC BTC l2s are coming as well dun Etc you know higher TPS lower gas proof State proof War Etc ET there's tons of really great brilliant people who are trying to uh you know innovate our way out of the structural disadvantages that industry has relative to web2 but there's still a lot to do that right compatibility I think one of the big things we can do is you know using web 3 interfaces on existing user interfaces versus new ones so this is something that you know poose to our part as well you have to do an like as a new user trying to get into web 3 you have to change all your behaviors right how many people had had installed a a Chrome browser plug-in wallet before webite absolutely zero there was no ven mode did not have a chrome plugin right like PayPal did not have like a chrome plugin like nobody nobody installs Chrome plugins in order to use money in their Bank like that's just not that's just not how it works right so now you're telling somebody that you have to do it completely different well now thankfully we're seeing a lot more progress in that direction at least right so I mean mobile native mobile apps were already a good start I mean uh and then now we're starting to think about you for us we're putting a wallet inside a telegram so that you can just access it because you're already using telegram maybe you can just use the wallet in there as well right but like you know you think about sort of you know the compatibility side of things that's really tough another one is like can we make it easy to migrate from web through architecture to web three architecture like that would be a huge thing I know that there are folks who are working on that sort of like terraform type of um uh you know projects to make it just really easy to to abstract away the underline and then kind of Port images but still a long way to go there and the other one that I think is just a really killer is if we can solve the Privacy issue and and I know that a lot of people are enthusiastic CK on this as as a poal solution uh there's just tons of research going on there who hears anyone working on privacy by the way okay yeah that makes sense I think privacy is just like everybody in the web to is still used to having privacy right you do something and it isn't literally on chain so that everybody in the world can look it up anytime they want that behavior change is so incompatible with the existing world that it's I mean yeah it's it's holding tons and tons of people back from using web 3 even even even people who know and understand who've gotten over complexity and trialability and observability and already like I get it but like I just don't want people to know that I have X amount of money in this quality you're just like okay how do we get around that so privacy is just compe it's just absolutely um then okay how do we abstract away things that targeted doctors don't need to know whether that's an Debs or users how do we abstract away gas how do we abstract with chains how do we abstract recovery phrases like these are all kind of wallet related cuz that's that's my domain but I'm sure there's tons of these and like game fli social fly like how do you just extract away the things like you know again maybe data ownership you don't have to sleep about where your data is stored it just feels like it what to except that you just own it somewhere and you can access it when you want and you things like that trialability so trialability I think is actually a really interesting one in what three because there's been so much innovation